Looking around us...

[eatonparkboy]

He got a very strong squad promoted out of the Championship. He did a good job but it was not a hopeless situation when he took over.

Everyone wants AN to do well and everyone wants us to be able to say we have this brilliant young manager which I get. But it's a results business.

As much as I despise modern football ethos, you are correct. I doubt there is anyone who does not want this club and manager and players to succeed. But if they don't then the attitude that makes people watch the Apprentice just for them to be fired will kick in and that will see a change.

I would still like us to appoint someone with nous and experience to help him. I don't know why but I see Holt and McAvoy as "yes boss" types. I want someone to tell him if he's made a blue.

Van Gaal anyone?

 

[Brian Fantana]

As much as I despise modern football ethos, you are correct. I doubt there is anyone who does not want this club and manager and players to succeed. But if they don't then the attitude that makes people watch the Apprentice just for them to be fired will kick in and that will see a change.

I would still like us to appoint someone with nous and experience to help him. I don't know why but I see Holt and McAvoy as "yes boss" types. I want someone to tell him if he's made a blue.

Van Gaal anyone?

I cannot imagine AN would stay around if the club said to him that we feel he needs his hand holding and so we have given him an older and wiser head to make sure he doesn't do anything silly. He was appointed / head hunted to be the manager of a Championship club with ambitions of gaining promotion, to suggest he should now have an experienced overseer is slightly odd.

 

[eatonparkboy]

I cannot imagine AN would stay around if the club said to him that we feel he needs his hand holding and so we have given him an older and wiser head to make sure he doesn't do anything silly. He was appointed / head hunted to be the manager of a Championship club with ambitions of gaining promotion, to suggest he should now have an experienced overseer is slightly odd.

I didn't say overseer. I talk of someone to help. Just a bit of advice. If he didn't want help then the others wouldn't be there would they?

Everybody cracks on about young manager playing  for Hamilton, been here less than a year and then expects that he can do it all. Not so IMO. He has no experience and neither do the rest of the team, especially of looking to bring in top players, of then handling top players and blending them into what is an ordinary squad.

Just someone sat in the stands who has been there and done it. Someone like a Coppell or a Graham.

 

[Brian Fantana]

I didn't say overseer. I talk of someone to help. Just a bit of advice. If he didn't want help then the others wouldn't be there would they?

Everybody cracks on about young manager playing  for Hamilton, been here less than a year and then expects that he can do it all. Not so IMO. He has no experience and neither do the rest of the team, especially of looking to bring in top players, of then handling top players and blending them into what is an ordinary squad.

Just someone sat in the stands who has been there and done it. Someone like a Coppell or a Graham.

I did think when I typed Overeer it might be a bit too pejorative, apologies.

I see the point you are making but there is no way he would accept that situation, can you imagine how humiliating it would be to, after a year in charge bring in a 'senior' person to help him? I wouldn't accept that in my job and I cannot imagine AN would. 

 

[eatonparkboy]

I did think when I typed Overeer it might be a bit too pejorative, apologies.

I see the point you are making but there is no way he would accept that situation, can you imagine how humiliating it would be to, after a year in charge bring in a 'senior' person to help him? I wouldn't accept that in my job and I cannot imagine AN would. 

Maybe I am imagining the second half of the season to be as tough as the first. Last season the man was rightly feted as a promising manager.

We started this season, something surely that AN could never have dreamed of doing, so positively despite some awful luck and the results gave us belief that he had indeed fulfilled his promise but also the promise that he made to us of sticking to his beliefs.

Following our home defeat to Leicester which as it happens was nothing to be ashamed of, we went to Newcastle and a freak result changed everything. A dreary home loss to Albion and the promise was ditched in favour of a defensive posture. At this point, personally I wished Man City had stuffed us and we had reverted to the style that had started the season so well. 

I think he became aware that this league is tough and unlike the major European leagues, the gulf between top and bottom is narrower and you can't assume anything. And I also believe he picked up on the negatives that naturally surround a period like that and maybe started to fear for his job. Maybe someone with a bit of experience could have just said to him that his job was safe and stick to his beliefs and that new signings in January would change things especially if confidence was still reasonably high.

But the very existence of this topic has brought his leadership and managerial qualities into question. And apart from the odd moan about the odd bad performance, either individually or team wise, this season should be an adventure to be enjoyed without the worry of whether we go down or not. Just because the money is increasing next season has no bearing on how you play.

He hasn't got the strongest or deepest of squads and maybe top heavy in certain areas. And he has tinkered to the extent that it could be guessing. Today amazed me that we played both our wingers on the same side. I hope it wasn't to stifle the opposition who are the bottom side and look very much like a bottom side. And why players were on the bench after good performances amazed me also. And I don't buy into the two games in three days. Goodness, footballers have never been so fit and strong so they ought to be able to  manage  it a couple of times a season.

Personally, I think it is a shame he couldn't work with Phelan. I can't prove it but believe that could have possibly been the dream ticket.

So when I talk of help I meant a kind of mentor who might tell him not to worry last game was a one off etc, not interfering but helping the mango in the direction that I feel he would really like to go in without any fear.

 

[eatonparkboy]

Just as an example, the pressure that Van Gaal has heaped on himself is his own doing. He is belligerent and unapologetic but the pressure on him is immense and they are only five points off a CL spot. I don't think a Norwich City manager, in this Premier League, should be under any pressure. Its counter productive. Only when a manager loses the supporters should the board act.

 

[Brian Fantana]

Maybe I am imagining the second half of the season to be as tough as the first. Last season the man was rightly feted as a promising manager.

We started this season, something surely that AN could never have dreamed of doing, so positively despite some awful luck and the results gave us belief that he had indeed fulfilled his promise but also the promise that he made to us of sticking to his beliefs.

Following our home defeat to Leicester which as it happens was nothing to be ashamed of, we went to Newcastle and a freak result changed everything. A dreary home loss to Albion and the promise was ditched in favour of a defensive posture. At this point, personally I wished Man City had stuffed us and we had reverted to the style that had started the season so well. 

I think he became aware that this league is tough and unlike the major European leagues, the gulf between top and bottom is narrower and you can't assume anything. And I also believe he picked up on the negatives that naturally surround a period like that and maybe started to fear for his job. Maybe someone with a bit of experience could have just said to him that his job was safe and stick to his beliefs and that new signings in January would change things especially if confidence was still reasonably high.

But the very existence of this topic has brought his leadership and managerial qualities into question. And apart from the odd moan about the odd bad performance, either individually or team wise, this season should be an adventure to be enjoyed without the worry of whether we go down or not. Just because the money is increasing next season has no bearing on how you play.

He hasn't got the strongest or deepest of squads and maybe top heavy in certain areas. And he has tinkered to the extent that it could be guessing. Today amazed me that we played both our wingers on the same side. I hope it wasn't to stifle the opposition who are the bottom side and look very much like a bottom side. And why players were on the bench after good performances amazed me also. And I don't buy into the two games in three days. Goodness, footballers have never been so fit and strong so they ought to be able to  manage  it a couple of times a season.

Personally, I think it is a shame he couldn't work with Phelan. I can't prove it but believe that could have possibly been the dream ticket.

So when I talk of help I meant a kind of mentor who might tell him not to worry last game was a one off etc, not interfering but helping the mango in the direction that I feel he would really like to go in without any fear.

I agree completely, AN and Phelan would be an awesome prospect working on history but I can well imagine the reaction of AN if it was suggested that MP come back now.

I just look at how far AN has come with us already and I am genuinely excited for the future.

 

[Brian Fantana]

Maybe I am imagining the second half of the season to be as tough as the first. Last season the man was rightly feted as a promising manager.

We started this season, something surely that AN could never have dreamed of doing, so positively despite some awful luck and the results gave us belief that he had indeed fulfilled his promise but also the promise that he made to us of sticking to his beliefs.

Following our home defeat to Leicester which as it happens was nothing to be ashamed of, we went to Newcastle and a freak result changed everything. A dreary home loss to Albion and the promise was ditched in favour of a defensive posture. At this point, personally I wished Man City had stuffed us and we had reverted to the style that had started the season so well. 

I think he became aware that this league is tough and unlike the major European leagues, the gulf between top and bottom is narrower and you can't assume anything. And I also believe he picked up on the negatives that naturally surround a period like that and maybe started to fear for his job. Maybe someone with a bit of experience could have just said to him that his job was safe and stick to his beliefs and that new signings in January would change things especially if confidence was still reasonably high.

But the very existence of this topic has brought his leadership and managerial qualities into question. And apart from the odd moan about the odd bad performance, either individually or team wise, this season should be an adventure to be enjoyed without the worry of whether we go down or not. Just because the money is increasing next season has no bearing on how you play.

He hasn't got the strongest or deepest of squads and maybe top heavy in certain areas. And he has tinkered to the extent that it could be guessing. Today amazed me that we played both our wingers on the same side. I hope it wasn't to stifle the opposition who are the bottom side and look very much like a bottom side. And why players were on the bench after good performances amazed me also. And I don't buy into the two games in three days. Goodness, footballers have never been so fit and strong so they ought to be able to  manage  it a couple of times a season.

Personally, I think it is a shame he couldn't work with Phelan. I can't prove it but believe that could have possibly been the dream ticket.

So when I talk of help I meant a kind of mentor who might tell him not to worry last game was a one off etc, not interfering but helping the mango in the direction that I feel he would really like to go in without any fear.

I agree with everything you said but standing back I cannot envisage a circumstance where AN would accept this. We either trust in AN and go with his judgment or we fire him and look for replacement / a new structure.

Good points though.

 

[Brian Fantana]

Good points though and well made, is what I meant to add.