Chris Hughton could yet be Norwich's salvation.

[ZLF]

He remains a capable manager who simply got the focus wrong while here for our second season - the barely subliminal message that we would be lucky to survive became a you are not good enough for this league message embedded in the players mind (in most cases he was right - but thats another debate) and so we became a self fulfilling prophecy for his fears.

He has left and what he does next does not particularly bother me - I dont get the extended hate and vitriol directed to the club and its current and ex players.  

 

[ncfcvet]

Houghton wasn't the worst manager by any means, but his style of play was never going to get the ncfc fans on their feet. I'd also lay a lot of the blame on Calderwood as well. His track record as a manager was dire and I'm not sure it was going to be any better as a coach. For example research his time as a Forest manager and the esteem in which he was held by forest fans. Holty's time was up as soon as Calderwood was linked with the club - he was the idiot who thought Holty was a left winger at forest.  Also Hoot's media demeanour was never going to fire anybody up - in front of the cameras or in the technical area. Compared to Lambert and NA.

Houghton was lucky in his first season finishing higher than Lambert did. There were two major no-shows from the baggies and man city. Seriously, would we have gone to the etihad and won if man c were in dogfight for the title....half their team were already on holiday. 

As a post-script I'm not a Lambert devotee. he was good and exciting, but honestly believe that Culverhouse was the major part of the tactical brains and talent spotting of that partnership. He also joined a "big" team in Division 3 who were expected to do what they did. The winning cycle and spirit then swept him through the Championship and into his first prem season. He was no fool leaving us when he did as there were strong possibilities of him having a poor season (possibly relegation) which would have lowered his standing before getting his move to a "bigger" club. Well played PL!

Agree, with previous posters....would love Hoots to get a job with a top 10 Championship team and extinguish their hopes for the season(s). Would happily wish him onto the binners as a replacement for Mickmac when he gets fed up or a better offer comes along.

otbc

 

[The Ghost of Michael Theo]

Actually I wanted to continue this point a little if I may;

Glenn Roeder was the worst manager we've had in the last 10 years. No question.

Hughton's biggest crime was negativity. It manifested from the pitch right through the whole club to the fans until it made the place awful. I'm not defending that. Last year was hard. But, to put that into perspective, he was playing in arguably the hardest league in the world, and he did make some decent signings for the club, even if he couldn't get them playing the way we wanted them to which eventually relegated us from the Premier League.

Compare that with the list of crimes against Roeder;

* Poor performances on the pitch

* Coming in and telling loads of players they were not good enough after one game - basically putting a division into the dressing room from the off.

* Getting rid of loads of decent players, from club legends to up and coming juniors.

* Bringing in more young loan players than you could fit in a mini bus. Quality, such as Troy Archibald-Henville (recently released from Swindon Town) & Omar Koroma (now of Forest Green Rovers).

* Selling Shackell, just so he could bring in Antoine Sibierski on loan.

* Relegating us from the 2nd tier of English football, when we had a squad most people though comfortably good enough for at least mid-table.

I think Roeder's list of charges outweighs those of Hughton's. But that's just my opinion

 

[cityoldboy]

Gunny was not a manager.

Grant was an Assistant manger

Both were their first ( and possibly last ) appointments as manager 

Rat was judged on his nasty character. 

Time will tell.

Leeds, Watford and Huddersfield have not appointed Hopeless Hugh and I doubt if any other

championship clubs will. 

 

[Lake District Canary]

I think Hughton saw the Norwich job as a way of moulding a team in his own image of the way he wanted to do things.  At Newcastle he seemed to have a strong set of players that already had a way of playing and that needed very little doing to it to get it working well. I don't think he had much opportunity to develop things at Birmingham - but it was the championship and there wasn't much money top spend.  At Norwich he was given a premiership team with aspirations to create a long term way of playing that would sustain a team in the top league - so his aspirations to create something from scratch tied in with the club's need to develop something sustainable and on from the Lambert approach, which was seen by quite a few observers as maybe running out of steam. 

I think he will get another chance, but he will need imo to have learned from his time at Norwich.  We were always going to be a tough job post Lambert as he was never going to recreate those three years, but his cautious approach just wasn't enough for results or style of play.  The problems we had are well documented, but it could be that at another club, he'll get the balance right between defence and attack, realise that he can't control everything on the pitch and allow his players a bit more freedom.  He seems to have got the respect of most players and people in football - and that can go a long way.  It wasn't enough at Norwich, but as with ex-players, such as Snodgrass, it would be interesting to see how they get on at different clubs. 

 

[Bethnal Yellow and Green]

The job Hughton did in his first season at Norwich was remarkable. I know everyone bangs on about 'false position' due to Man City 'being on the beach' etc etc.

But considering the minimal amount of investment Hughton could make that season, and the squad he inherited, who while incredibly likeable weren't that talented (look how their careers have progressed since then), it is a major achivement to keep the squad in the league, let alone finish 11th.

Hughton was Norwich's saviour, he secured Norwich another Premier League season which allowed Norwich to pay off their debts and gave Norwich a year of a mega TV money, and mega parachute payments now.

You could see last season he wanted to play more attacking, expansive football at the start - nothing defensive was happening in that game versus Everton - but the pressure of the job meant he went back to the defensive football that was such a success the previous season.

He is currently on a break from football apparently, and has turned down the opportunity to interview for a few clubs already this season - he'll be back sooner or later and will contiune to be a good manager.

 

[The Great Mass Debater]

Compare that with the list of crimes against Roeder;

* Poor performances on the pitch

* Coming in and telling loads of players they were not good enough after one game - basically putting a division into the dressing room from the off.

* Getting rid of loads of decent players, from club legends to up and coming juniors.

Id argue that Hughton was guilty of these sins as well

 

[The Great Mass Debater]

The job Hughton did in his first season at Norwich was remarkable. I know everyone bangs on about 'false position' due to Man City 'being on the beach' etc etc.

But considering the minimal amount of investment Hughton could make that season, and the squad he inherited, who while incredibly likeable weren't that talented (look how their careers have progressed since then), it is a major achivement to keep the squad in the league, let alone finish 11th.

Hughton was Norwich's saviour, he secured Norwich another Premier League season which allowed Norwich to pay off their debts and gave Norwich a year of a mega TV money, and mega parachute payments now.

You could see last season he wanted to play more attacking, expansive football at the start - nothing defensive was happening in that game versus Everton - but the pressure of the job meant he went back to the defensive football that was such a success the previous season.

He is currently on a break from football apparently, and has turned down the opportunity to interview for a few clubs already this season - he'll be back sooner or later and will contiune to be a good manager.

Was he not one of many managers though who could have achieved this though. Its always annoyed me that when many (and Im not accusing you here Bethnal) celebrate this achievement as if Hughton was the only one who could have done it. Hughton's achievements are singular in my opinion - the 10 match unbeaten run. Ill hold my hands up, that run was impressive - not that it happened, but the manner in which it happened. This was the only period in Hughtons reign where things made sense. There seemed to be a plan, it seemed to be effective. The defence looked solid, and we looked capable of nicking a lead and defending it. The rest of his tenure however was awful. Totally ineffective football. Hughton may have kept us up, but I think plenty of other managers could also have done this, and more comfortably, in multiple other ways. Hughtons way was not the only way, but he drilled this mantra into the club. There was no way we could ever hope to compete against such quality. We were beaten before we even walked onto the pitch. We went into every game with fear, frightened to play our own game. This is an awful football philosophy and was never ever destined to take the club anywhere. I hated his attrition football. It was ineffective, totally unsuited to the players he inherited. Hughton in my opinion was guilty of feeling he needed to start from scratch, rather than continue to good work that had gone before (like at Swansea). Does this come from his ego, or his insecurity? He wanted to be able to take the credit for any success, rather than having to pay homage to the foundations laid by Lambert. Consequently, he has to take ultimate responsibility for the clubs failure.

I dont think he was a good manager. Perhaps he wasnt the worst, but he wasnt good. That 10 game run/blip was the only reason we survived that season, our ultimate fate the season after was the true baseline and many were too blind to see it. When that run ended we were awful, from then and til the end of Hughtons reign

 

[The Ghost of Michael Theo]

Id argue that Hughton was guilty of these sins as well

Point 1 I agree.

If in point 2 and 3, you're referring to Grant Holt;

* The first thing he did when he walked in the door was give him a new contract. This was after he'd already handed in a transfer request to our previous manager.

* The next year, he sold him. From there - I'd refer to Bethnal's comment above, in that he hasn't exactly pulled up any trees since he left. People were angry with Hughton's style that Holt only scored a handful of goals in his last year with us. But he's hardly scored many more since he left, has he? I'd argue that was a good piece of business.

 

[The Ghost of Michael Theo]

Was he not one of many managers though who could have achieved this though. Its always annoyed me that when many (and Im not accusing you here Bethnal) celebrate this achievement as if Hughton was the only one who could have done it.

What?

So, Churchill shouldn't be celebrated as a great Prime Minister, because if his neighbor Joe Jones was given the job, he may have done it better?

I'm not saying Hughton was amazing by any stretch. But people bang on all the time that football is a results based business. That is ultimately how managers are judged.

 

[Bethnal Yellow and Green]

Was he not one of many managers though who could have achieved this though. Its always annoyed me that when many (and Im not accusing you here Bethnal) celebrate this achievement as if Hughton was the only one who could have done it. Hughton's achievements are singular in my opinion - the 10 match unbeaten run. Ill hold my hands up, that run was impressive - not that it happened, but the manner in which it happened. This was the only period in Hughtons reign where things made sense. There seemed to be a plan, it seemed to be effective. The defence looked solid, and we looked capable of nicking a lead and defending it. The rest of his tenure however was awful. Totally ineffective football. Hughton may have kept us up, but I think plenty of other managers could also have done this, and more comfortably, in multiple other ways. Hughtons way was not the only way, but he drilled this mantra into the club. There was no way we could ever hope to compete against such quality. We were beaten before we even walked onto the pitch. We went into every game with fear, frightened to play our own game. This is an awful football philosophy and was never ever destined to take the club anywhere. I hated his attrition football. It was ineffective, totally unsuited to the players he inherited. Hughton in my opinion was guilty of feeling he needed to start from scratch, rather than continue to good work that had gone before (like at Swansea). Does this come from his ego, or his insecurity? He wanted to be able to take the credit for any success, rather than having to pay homage to the foundations laid by Lambert. Consequently, he has to take ultimate responsibility for the clubs failure.

I dont think he was a good manager. Perhaps he wasnt the worst, but he wasnt good. That 10 game run/blip was the only reason we survived that season, our ultimate fate the season after was the true baseline and many were too blind to see it. When that run ended we were awful, from then and til the end of Hughtons reign

I don't think many managers could have achieved that to be honest - the defensive stability he brought into the players provided a base to build on and kept Norwich up that season - there is no other way to see it than that.

I would also argue that Hughton isn't a manager who is automatically defensive, he wasn't at Newcastle or Birmingham and he wasn't when he started at Norwich - but quickly became that way as he saw it as the best way to survive. Few teams avoid relegation by being gung-ho attack.

I don't think the approach Hughton took was anything as devious as wanting to build his own legacy etc, just he looked at the players and felt changes needed to be made. Lambert, who built that team, walked out on it because he felt it wasn't good enough to survive and felt the club weren't offering enough money to rebuild. Hughton made that team work, and whilst it wasn't pretty at times, I can't think of many clubs who are looking to avoid relegation as their number one priority as being particulary fun to watch.

Of course he made mistakes, and he lost his way by the second season. It's very hard to change mentality half way through a season and the players he brought in during the summer to help Norwich play more progressive football weren't working. Just by looking at the signings Hughton made in the second summer you can see he wasn't planning another season of defensive football - but 'the best laid plans' and all that.

Hughton isn't a brilliant manager, but Norwich fans should be very grateful for what he achieved in his first season at the club - how many others could have achieved that we will never know, but we shouldn't worry about that, just the fact that it was achieved. Much of what is good about Norwich now, is directly due to them avoiding relegation in that season. 

 

[Yellow Fever]

Hughton has now applied for the Leeds job, as has Ian Culverhouse. Be interesting to see what comes of that.

 

[cityoldboy]

Leeds : That's not really a job more like a mini break. 

 

[splutcho]

Grant, Roeder, and Gunn were all far, far worse. Going back further, Rioch too.

 

[cityoldboy]

Hughton isn't a brilliant manager, but Norwich fans should be very grateful for what he achieved in his first season at the club - how many others could have achieved that we will never know, but we shouldn't worry about that, just the fact that it was achieved. Much of what is good about Norwich now, is directly due to them avoiding relegation in that season. 

So much that is good about Norwich now is down to Hughton being fired directly due to him relegating us and getting a better manager in. 

 

[Watling the Gnome]

When Hughton managed Birmingham (it's an effort not to call him "Houghton" as I'd got used to it with, ahem, other sites) Birmingham City scored a shedload of goals - 5th highest scorers in the league, from memory.  It doesn't follow that he's always a negative, safety-first manager - he was with us, no question about it, but he is not entirely one-dimensional in his approach.  Look at what he did at Birmingham City with a virtual basket case of a club, and I can see why that was a big factor in Norwich City appointing him.

 

[Watling the Gnome]

If you look at Hughton's recent management career, he was "par" at Newcastle, over-achieved at Birmingham, and probably under-achieved with Norwich City.  I don't hate him, feel sorry for him, love him, like him, dislike him, etc etc etc.  I believe he did his best.  That's all I can reasonably ask.  Put it this way, if he came back as manager of Leeds, I wouldn't boo him for being Chris Hughton.  I'd probably boo him for being Leeds United's manager, but that's just panto.

 

[Din]

I was actually still backing Hughton when a lot of fans wanted him gone. It was at the start of February when we lost to Cardiff that I finally lost it. I can see why the board kept hold of him as long as they did though, as our home form in the second half of the season was actually quite good and up until we lost 1-0 to West Brom towards the end of the season I actually thought we would stay up, as I'm sure a lot of our fans did. The fact was that in the end Hughton had to go, and even if he'd kept us up I think we would've sacked him at the end of the season. I am thankful to CH for what he did for us in our first season, getting us to 11th, and giving us some great memories, such as wins over Arsenal and United. But as I said, in the end, he had to go. 

But anyway, let's stop talking about Hughton. The past is the past, and all that matters is that we now have a manager who in the first few games has shown that he likes to play good, attacking football, and bring promising youngsters into the team. Let's just be thankful for that and not worry about what's going on with a former manager. 

 

[cityoldboy]

If he becomes Leeds manager he can buy Becchio off us and not play him again !

 

[Bethnal Yellow and Green]

So much that is good about Norwich now is down to Hughton being fired directly due to him relegating us and getting a better manager in. 

No where near enough evidence to come to that conclusion yet. 

Adams has looked okay in his first few games, but impossible to begin to judge who is the better manager.