Cardiff Dossier on Malky MacKay to the FA

[BarclayBoy88]

Like I said, it's rewriting history for the sake of political expedience, and I've never liked that sort of thing. It's a bit disturbing that so many people think it's right and proper to do so.

I'm not for one minute saying he should be removed from any hall of fame or art-work at Carrow Road. However The impression I got from the quote I previously quoted was that as he has played for us and did well for us, we should be more tolerant of him and what he has done, which personally I find very strange.

 

[Josh]

Cardiff City: "That the LMA has sought to criticise the Club for the timing of the report to the FA is preposterous, because the offensive communications have been in the knowledge & possession of the LMA for months.
"When the messages came to light, 3 months ago the Club encouraged Mr Moody & Mr Mackay to deal with issue directly with the FA.
"With the backing of the LMA, (they) chose to do nothing.
"LMA were therefore complicit in attempt to conceal messages (of which there were many more than the 2 texts acknowledged by Mr Mackay)."
"It is entirely reprehensible LMA put out statement which seeks to dismiss deeply offensive racist comments as 'friendly banter'.
 
The LMA had the texts - and more - for three months.

 

[lyb]

Cardiff City: "That the LMA has sought to criticise the Club for the timing of the report to the FA is preposterous, because the offensive communications have been in the knowledge & possession of the LMA for months."When the messages came to light, 3 months ago the Club encouraged Mr Moody & Mr Mackay to deal with issue directly with the FA.

"With the backing of the LMA, (they) chose to do nothing.

"LMA were therefore complicit in attempt to conceal messages (of which there were many more than the 2 texts acknowledged by Mr Mackay)."

"It is entirely reprehensible LMA put out statement which seeks to dismiss deeply offensive racist comments as 'friendly banter'.
 
The LMA had the texts - and more - for three months.

Cor, that really is pretty damning. Malky really was an utter idiot even applying for the Crystal Palace job when he knew this was hanging over his head.

 

[Bethnal Yellow and Green]

Like I said, it's rewriting history for the sake of political expedience, and I've never liked that sort of thing. It's a bit disturbing that so many people think it's right and proper to do so.

People aren't saying remove him from the history books, scrub out his name from the old programs, unperson him!

Just Norwich don't have to honour him in their Hall of Fame anymore.

There is a distinct difference from erasing him Malkay from all Norwich history, and putting him up on a pedestal as one of the Norwich 'greats'.

 

[lyb]

Recognising someones achievements by putting them in the hall of fame is part of the club's history. We could always create a hall of infamy for players that have achieved the hall of fame and then gone on to do something shameful, but taking away the acknowledgement of the contribution they made to the club at the time is not right.

 

[Jimmy smith]

Like I said, it's rewriting history for the sake of political expedience, and I've never liked that sort of thing. It's a bit disturbing that so many people think it's right and proper to do so.

So what about the whole Jimmy Saville thing (not that Malky is on the same level as that!) Surely you can see why his plaques were taken down. To be fair though, I still hear the odd Gary Glitter tune!

They had this with Ched Evans and his POTS award in League 1. I think if what you've done wrong isn't related to what you achieved, you should keep your award usually. If in the t's and c's for that POTS award it included something like "conducted himself in a professional manner off the pitch" then yes, he wasn't the best and he shouldn't have that award but if it just for on the pitch achievements then he's earnt it, just like he did in the eyes of the law his jail sentence and further punishments (registered offender etc).

What does the 'hall of fame' mean anyway? Is it exclusively there for people that have served the club well or is it there to represent being a nice guy as well?

 

[Josh]

The statement in full:

We had not intended to comment on matters which have been reported in the press over the last two days in relation to Malky Mackay and Iain Moody. However, following the statement released by the LMA last night we feel compelled to respond.

The LMA is the representative voice of managers, and whilst we understand it seeks to act in the best interests of its members, one of its major aims is to "encourage honourable practice, conduct and courtesy in all professional activity”.

Regrettably, we feel that the LMA has done no such thing in its representation of Mr Mackay and Mr Moody. The LMA were aware of the allegations from the morning of the search order, and their lawyers acted for Mr Mackay and Mr Moody throughout the legal process.

That the LMA has sought to criticise the Club for the timing of the report to the FA is preposterous, because the offensive communications have been in the knowledge and possession of the LMA for many months. When the messages came to light, over three months ago, the Club strongly encouraged and advised Mr Moody and Mr Mackay to deal with the issue directly with the FA.

It was made clear to them, and their LMA appointed lawyers, that the nature of the communications meant the Club was under a duty to report their findings to the FA if they did not take appropriate action themselves. Nevertheless, with the backing of the LMA, Mr Moody and Mr Mackay chose to do nothing. The LMA were therefore complicit in the attempt to conceal these messages (of which there were many more than the two isolated texts acknowledged by Mr Mackay).

We also point out that the LMA members have a ‘Code of Conduct’ incorporated into their managerial contracts. One of the requirements is “A Manager shall not use racist or other discriminatory language. A Manager’s behaviour should demonstrate to Players and other employees under his control that discrimination in any form is unacceptable.”

We therefore find it entirely reprehensible that the LMA should itself put out a statement which seeks to dismiss deeply offensive racist comments as 'friendly banter'.

If that is the view held by the LMA, as appears from its statement, we consider that Richard Bevan’s position is untenable and we call for his resignation.

 

[lyb]

So what about the whole Jimmy Saville thing (not that Malky is on the same level as that!) Surely you can see why his plaques were taken down. To be fair though, I still hear the odd Gary Glitter tune!

They had this with Ched Evans and his POTS award in League 1. I think if what you've done wrong isn't related to what you achieved, you should keep your award usually. If in the t's and c's for that POTS award it included something like "conducted himself in a professional manner off the pitch" then yes, he wasn't the best and he shouldn't have that award but if it just for on the pitch achievements then he's earnt it, just like he did in the eyes of the law his jail sentence and further punishments (registered offender etc).

Yup, Jimmy Savile was a child abuser and his knighthood was for 'charitable services' where his focus was children's charities so it's utterly appropriate for it to be stripped when the later actions were in direct conflict to what he was awarded it for in the first place. The Hall of Fame isn't an acknowledgement of whether someone is a really great guy or not, it's an acknowledgement of what they've done for the club on the pitch.

 

[Jimmy smith]

You think making racist comments is on par with a dodgy expenses claim.

It depends on the level of the crime but both can be worse than the other.

Is stealing millions in expenses worse than using a derogatory term to describe a shop or something to a friend nothing to do with the term used? Yes

Is chucking a couple of miles onto your mileage to round it up to the nearest 5 worse than shouting abuse and making offensive gestures at a person mocking their race? No

All are wrong but there's a level to it all.

 

[skijumptoes]

We're yet to see the FA lay their card down yet, and already we have the LMA, Cardiff and Malky/Moody sat in their respective corners, legal representatives must be rubbing their hands in anticipation and their heads in pain!

I personally felt the LMA originally showed quite a sensible stance in regards to these texts being private material... The trouble is, they are no longer private so i guess have to be judged on the fact that they're now in the public domain and a suitable punishment based around that.  I cannot see how they can defend him and not lose respect now he's been hung out to dry in public.

 

[Beauseant]

I did say there was going to be more to come......

 

[ZLF]

My personal opinion is that Malky is on the wall of fame for his footballing services to the club - and in doing so we are marking him out as one of the clubs most outstanding contributors in our history.   

If he commits a crime related to football I would expect him to lose that extra level of recognition as he does become tainted;   it happens regularly outside of football (honours systems and others) and the same should apply here.

 

[Fenway Frank]

If someone was to shout out something similar to any of Malky's texts at the game tomorrow they would be arrested, thrown out and banned from attending any matches for a long time. I don't get all this "he's a lovely guy and we've all done something silly " as said by 'Arry. If the supporters at Wolves are found guilty, would they be let off because they say "sorry but everyone has done something stupid at least once"  ? 

 

[Keckers]

There is no place for this at our club, including honouring former players. The Hall of Fame is dynamic, not static. If someone does something heinous enough, they should be removed. Mackay and Mendham should both be removed from the Hall of Fame. There really is no other point if view that doesn't in some way, directly or indirectly, condone his actions. Let's not draw unrealistic comparisons with someone like Saville. Completely different situations. He should receive a sanction and be allowed to rehabilitate himself but until he does he should be removed from the Hall of Fame. Can always be re-inducted when he has shown he has changed his behaviour.

 

[lyb]

There is no place for this at our club, including honouring former players. The Hall of Fame is dynamic, not static. If someone does something heinous enough, they should be removed. Mackay and Mendham should both be removed from the Hall of Fame. There really is no other point if view that doesn't in some way, directly or indirectly, condone his actions. Let's not draw unrealistic comparisons with someone like Saville. Completely different situations. He should receive a sanction and be allowed to rehabilitate himself but until he does he should be removed from the Hall of Fame. Can always be re-inducted when he has shown he has changed his behaviour.

The hall of fame is only dynamic in the sense that new players come along and contribute more to the club's success on the pitch. What they contributed to the club, is fixed in history and if the club recognised it by putting it in the hall of fame then it should stand whatever happens afterwards. Put a mark against their name on there that marks them as someone who has later shamed themselves to the embarrassment of the club, but retrospectively taking away recognition of something that has been done and won't change actually demeans the hall of fame entirely by making it something subject to the politics of the day. The club would be cheapening itself by pandering to current affairs in this way. 

 

[Yellowfuture]

The LMA are as deeply embroiled in this as Malky, even deeper maybe. Their response was a considered reply which they as a professional organisation had time to think about , take legal advice, soundings from diversity groups etc. but what they issued was a statement that reflects a "systemic racism" ,haven't we heard that before, within their organisation. This was not a knee jerk reply to a journo's question from a single member of the LMA, this was the considered corporate response, an apology on that basis carries little weight for me.

 

[Andy]

At least Malky has made a public apology, condemned racism and agreed to attend racial awareness training. In fact he has said everything that should have been in the original LMA statement.

He claims that he only sent 3 unacceptable texts out of a total of 10,000 and is truly sorry for what he did. As far as I'm concerned, that's fair enough - he lost his job & is very unlikely to work again at the highest level in management. Perhaps he could devote some time to promoting equality in football and maybe he will be welcomed back at some point in the future.

The LMA, however, have shown themselves to be hopelessly out of touch.

If you missed his interview you can see it here

http://www1.skysports.com/watch/video/sports/football/teams/cardiff-city/9435082/malky-mackay-apologises

 

[Canaryboy]

How quickly we turn on our own. Yes he has made an almighty screw up. He has apologised move on and not persecute This ex canary

Been considering this point, about whether we should stand by him and cut him some slack because he happens to have been a great player for us - or 'one of us' so to speak. 

A big question that I've got though, is where are all the former teammates and Cardiff players coming out to publicly back him and offer support? Not just players who happen to be black either, People like Iwan, Eadie and Hucks who all played with Malky and are constantly on twitter.

You could perhaps say that white faces are reluctant to show public support in case they get caught up in the witch hunt and tarred with the same brush (e.g. could go down badly, like the LMA statement). But what about his many black teammates and colleagues? They could speak up in his defence, none of done so far. For example active tweeters such as....

• Daryl Russell
• Adrian Forbes
• Zema Abbey
• Damien Francis
• Leon McKenzie

None of them have said a word. Then there are people like Frazier Campbell who haven't either. Does he just not have any friends in football? They don't seem to be rallying around in support of their former captain, has there been any former teammate, player or staff member, to come out with something as simple as "I've known Malky for years and don't believe he is a racist". 

You are asking us to give him the benefit of the doubt because he happened to be a great servant for us during some good times, but his former teammates (people who actually know him) are hardly rallying around to give glowing character references?

 

[Loyal canary]

I think there is more to come out. He eloquently put his case on sky tonight. I was there when he scored against the scum. I was there when he was immense in the game against Burnley in the promotion season. I for one forgive him after what he has down for the club.

 

[skijumptoes]

The LMA are as deeply embroiled in this as Malky, even deeper maybe. Their response was a considered reply which they as a professional organisation had time to think about , take legal advice, soundings from diversity groups etc. but what they issued was a statement that reflects a "systemic racism".

I don't see how it reflects systematic racism unto it's self as an association if that's what you're implying?

The statement was the LMA acting in defence of one of it's members, the statement was issued on behalf of Malky wasn't it?, not in response to him.  I think people are forgetting what the LMA's role in this is, to publicly condemn a member before all the facts have come out would go against everything they stand for.