Home Grown

[derehamyella]

See McNally says in the Pink One, that they are looking to bring in more British players than overseas ones.   there are some good British players but more thin on the ground than they use to be.  The homework has to be little extra on overseas players.  we have had one or two good ones and some bad

Full Artile

http://www.pinkun.com/norwich-city/norwich_city_target_home_comforts_in_transfer_market_1_4107448

 

[morty]

Nothing hugely surprising in anything he says, but I agree, the British players that I would like, that are also likely, are thin on the ground.

Wouldn't mind Charlie Austin, but all the talk is of him going to Newcastle.

 

[KeiranShikari]

Triple raid for Sam Byram, Alex Mowatt and that other good young Leeds player who's name escapes me it is then.

Austin will be a bit out of our pay grade and Jerome is better anyway.

 

[morty]

Triple raid for Sam Byram, Alex Mowatt and that other good young Leeds player who's name escapes me it is then.

Austin will be a bit out of our pay grade and Jerome is better anyway.

I would be thing as well as Jerome, not instead of. Probably instead of Ricky.

But yeah, I can't see it happening.

I think we have the nucleus of a reasonable Premiership side, but whoever we buy has to be a starter, for me. I wouldn't be happy with just seeing the side that finished the season padded out with lower league squad fillers.

What we buy has to be better than we have already.

 

[KeiranShikari]

lol I know. I was implying that he wouldn't get into the team ahead of Jerome. I reckon another striker will be on the cards though, with Lafferty and Wolf packing their bags. 

Certainly have a decent side. I'm still somewhat surprised we managed to keep hold of some of them last winter, even if it was skin of the teeth with Olsson.

Think we need a mix of both, young players to polish and the tested quality. 

 

[derehamyella]

I think the main crux of the matter is knowing and having watched the player playing in the Prem.   Take  Mulumbu  he isn't home grown but has the prem experience that would give scouts and AN a beter knowledge of the player. 

Wasn't Mulumbu a bit tempremental ? 

 

[ZLF]

I understand and think its always better to know that they have adapted to the british culture & blood and thunder physical type of football - as long as they are good enough and price acceptable.    I think byram would be a bit of a risk and possibly over priced for example - he had a poor season.

Mulumbu I am optimistic about  

 

[morty]

I understand and think its always better to know that they have adapted to the british culture & blood and thunder physical type of football - as long as they are good enough and price acceptable.    I think byram would be a bit of a risk and possibly over priced for example - he had a poor season.

Mulumbu I am optimistic about  

The rumour that Mulumbu is a done deal seems to be gathering pace..

 

[Boyerboy]

Two things:

Firstly, I would not be keen on Austin.  He is a good striker who has had a good season.  But, very very few strikers have a good second season.   Defenders and coaches watch and study carefully and work out how best to play them.  Recent history is full of strikers who took the Prem by storm and then failed to deliver second season such as Michu, Lambert, Jelavic, Benteke, Papiss Cisse, Ba, Graham, our own dear Holt.  The good ones come back like Benteke and others fade away like Graham and Cisse.

It will be interesting to see how Austin and Ings get on next season and Harry Kane for that matter.   I believe that at least two of them will disappoint relative to last season. 

Returning to the topic, the risk is not foreign players but rather, players from abroad.  Both Olssen and Bassong  are foreign players but came from British clubs.   As I have observed several times in threads about Ricky, there is a high failure rate with players from other leagues coming to the Prem.   For us,onlyTettey has worked in recent years.  I understand the caution.

 

[Scott]

I'd like to see us bring in British players, just so perhaps the England squad gathers momentum and gives us something to cheer about for once lol. However, we have had a few very good foreign players so I suppose you have to juggle the pros and cons really!

 

[The Great Mass Debater]

Me personally, whilst I like the idea of British players, I wonder just how feasible this is. We're a Premiership club now, so any League One players we might be interested in will come with a relatively hefty price relative to quality (take Pilks, who we signed with a serious injury, asked him to jump two divisions, and whilst he was superb in his first season, despite proving himself at this level we sold him at a loss). Championship clubs will also sniff the money and demand top dollar - especially as most Championship clubs think thye have a shot at promotion so will want considerable compensation for their so-called stars (unproven). Then you get to the Premiership - and with all clubs trying to improve their home grown quota, the good English players come at a premium transfer fee, or if free will want hefty wages.

Which leaves the youth, who by definition are not established players, and most are still probably not ready.

Contrast that with cherry picking players out of favour in the top leagues on the continent, or the top players at second tier clubs in foreign leagues, who can come in at Michu prices.

I think relatively it will be quite difficult for Norwich to pursue a home-grown policy. With a decent scouting network, we might be better off shopping abroad - a club like ours is not in the position of needing to increase home-grown players

 

[Scott]

^ Agree, we have a fairly decent youth system. Although it is a bit of a shame as we havent really had any top top players come through the ranks recently and pushing into the first team (Josh Murphy perhaps being the only one) but even now he finds himself cast out on loan or barely making the subs bench

 

[The Great Mass Debater]

Geography and the 90 minute rule really derailed our youth programme. My understanding of having category 1 academy status though means we can raid other clubs (with lower categories) for their best players for peanuts.

Not something I agree with, but the reason behind ploughin 2m a season into it. I think its a terrible plan really, leading to real financial problems for teams that rely on big sales of players they've brought through and meaning many top youth players end up rotting in academies.

Think its supposed to mean the best players end up at the best clubs with access to the best facilities and coaches, but I think its bad news for the football pyramid. The loan system might redress the lack of first team experience, as might the mooted League 2B, but personally I think the whole thing is 2 fingers up to how football works in this country.

Still, that is the system, and at the moment with us having category 1 status it works in our favour. We can also offer top youngsters a realistic path to the first team so we are an attractive option/alternative to having Yaya Toure blocking your path to the first team

 

[Suffolk Canary]

Me personally, whilst I like the idea of British players, I wonder just how feasible this is. We're a Premiership club now, so any League One players we might be interested in will come with a relatively hefty price relative to quality (take Pilks, who we signed with a serious injury, asked him to jump two divisions, and whilst he was superb in his first season, despite proving himself at this level we sold him at a loss). Championship clubs will also sniff the money and demand top dollar - especially as most Championship clubs think thye have a shot at promotion so will want considerable compensation for their so-called stars (unproven). Then you get to the Premiership - and with all clubs trying to improve their home grown quota, the good English players come at a premium transfer fee, or if free will want hefty wages.

Exactly. Premiership money has filtered down into the championship, and there's nothing worse than trying to buy something as cheap as possible when the seller knows you have a bulging wallet. And the chances of picking a gem from League 1/2 is extremely rare.  The best approach imo is to pick a few reserve players from current Prem teams who will take the cash to fund better players (e.g. Dorrans) who are proven to do a job at this level. 

If you want to be really cheap, then its best to look abroad. Lots of big european teams depend on selling players to function, such as PSV. But they tend to be completely unsuitable for english football (RVW), or a great success (tettey). English players tend to be the safe option, but reliable.

Also, think its important to note that McNally said "the domestic market".  There's a big difference between British players and British-based players.  

 

[GJP]

Firstly, I would not be keen on Austin.  

If we, Norwich City, can't be keen on signing someone who has just scored 18 Premier League goals and is around the England squad who can we be keen on?

 

[derehamyella]

that is a fair point GJP.   we all have favourites  and those we don't rate, but at end of the day it isnt down to us thank goodness.  but Austin as you say is proven and a goal scorer.    I was surprised Liverpool went for Ings  when Austin is sitting there perhaps waiting to move

 

[Scott]

If we, Norwich City, can't be keen on signing someone who has just scored 18 Premier League goals and is around the England squad who can we be keen on?

I'd have him in a heartbeat! He scored 18 goals in a team that has been relegated and only got 30 points the whole season...seem's pretty good going to me! 

 

[Yellow Fever]

Going back to McNally, I don't think he specified English or British players, but rather players who had proven themselves in the British leagues. Dorrans, Brady and Mulumbu all fall into that category. Others coming in will probably fall into that category as well, though McNally did leave room for 'one or two foreign players' so you never know. Also, we already have two 'foreign players' in Odjidja-Ofoe and Andreu, who will be like new signings this season thus strengthening the squad further.

 

[derehamyella]

I would class Andreu  in the British type players as he was with ANeil upt north  

 

[Din]

One thing about the English clubs, is they tend to massively over-value their players, when you could get a player who is as good for a fair bit less in Italy or Germany for example, even if they are slightly more of a risk. This is even more true about players from the home nations in particular England. Look at the Raheem Sterling situation right now. Liverpool apparently want £50m. I know he's only 20 and undoubtedly a good player, but for £50m you expect someone who is world class, and is guaranteed to be world class for the next few seasons, he certainly isn't that. He got 7 goals and 7 assists in the league last season, Eden Hazard was the same age as him when he signed for Chelsea from Lille, and the season before he got 15 goals and 20 assists, and yet went for £30m. Would Liverpool be demanding £50m for Sterling if he wasn't English, and hadn't been developed in their youth academy. I don't think so.

Also look at Shane Long who went to Southampton for £15m, Lallana who went to Liverpool for £25m, Luke Shaw to United for £30m, and that's just in the Premier League. The top Championship strikers from last season such as Deeney, McCormack and Rhodes would all cost in and around £10m.

I would agree that I would like a fair bit of out business to be done with English teams, in particular involving experience players in the Premier League, however I would also like us to look abroad for one or two of our signings.