Seriously, I need some reassurance......

[Yellow Fever]

IMO, we have now reached a point where we could push on to fight for a play-off place or drift lower with further disjointed performances. This is a test for Neil, and how he and the players respond to it will determine our immediate future. He took over a squad which had taken 10 points from 5 games, and saw a win against Bouremouth to begin the honeymoon, which stuttered through the Cardiff win and then faltered completely against Brentford. Can he turn that around? We hope so, but hope is easy, achievement much more difficult.

 

[morty]

Did people, perhaps, get a bit carried away with him winning his first two games?

I think that maybe people need to shift their expectations somewhat. All things considered, the playoffs will be a good achievement, and thats not saying I'd be satisfied with it not resulting in promotion, but I recognise just how difficult a season it has been so far, in so many ways, and for so many different reasons.

Alex needs time to get into the players heads and build the core of the team how he wants it to be, but unfortunately some seem to think he would be an instant success and take the league by storm.

As previously said, he has a 66% win rate so far, against teams above us in the league.

Put your panic buttons away.

 

[Paul Handscombe]

He hasn't had 6 points from 3 games he has had 3 from 2.  The first one he had been there a day and it was Phealans team not his.

The Cardiff game we were good first half and first 10 mins of second half then we were abject and lucky to away with a win, the Saturday when you could say that this was his first real team selection and formation after being in the job a full 2 weeks and got to know the players and team.

He picked the wrong team, wrong formation and players out of position.  Everyone and I mean everyone know what an crap player Whitaker has been at right back so why on gods earth would you move him to midfield!!  If you asked the 22000 home fans to pick their starting 11 and formation with the available players for Saturday not 1 would have chosen that team, hardly anyone would pick Whitaker at RB let alone centre mid.

as I have said before cheap option again by the board, not enough experience and I can't see us beating any of the teams above or around us.

 

[morty]

Oh dear, someone got out of bed the wrong side lol.

 

[Paul Handscombe]

Not at all just a realist, and one of the reasons I am not renewing my season tickets next year.

 

[Yellow Fever]

I agree with Paul that Bournemouth was Phelan's result, so it's 3 points from 2 games for me as well. Neil's decision to confront the players publicly could work or could backfire, but we won't know which until the Birmingham game, but it needs to work quickly if we are going to stay in the play-off race now.

 

[morty]

Okay pedants, a 50% win rate it is then 

 

[Paul Handscombe]

I think that's the nicest thing you've called me Morty

 

[RhythmicTheory]

I agree with Paul that Bournemouth was Phelan's result, so it's 3 points from 2 games for me as well. Neil's decision to confront the players publicly could work or could backfire, but we won't know which until the Birmingham game, but it needs to work quickly if we are going to stay in the play-off race now.

I agree Phelan (and holt) prepared the team for Bournemouth, but Alex's game management for the last 30 got us the result.  Think you're being a little unfair there bud. 

 

[SussexYellow]

OK my previous posts said I thought Alex Neil would either be a roaring success or a complete disaster no middle ground, and I think I was the unhappiest bunny here when Mike Phelan left because we really could use his experience.

But the amount of panic on this thread is unreal. Why was Whittaker put in midfield, probably because AN had little choice. We had 4 central midfielders unavailable. Seriously what would you do when your choice is between an experienced international who has played this role before or giving a youngster a first start. OK it may not have come off but it the selection is not as unsound as it is being portrayed.

Did we play hoofball? Well I started another thread on a detailed conversation I had with a knowledgeable Bees supporter who said the way to undo them was the ball over the top because their defence was slow on the turn. So maybe it was a valid tactic. The fact it did not come off does not make it less valid. This is sport both teams can not win.

Yes we looked poor but the biggest difference between the teams for me was that Brentford looked technically superior to us in their control of the ball. Alex Neil has not destroyed this ability in our players and neither has Neil Adams or Mike Phelan created it.

Yes we looked to lack passion. That is a concern and we need to watch how Alex Neil addresses it. 

The criticism of Alex Neil after two or three games, take your pick, is just unreal. SAF is arguably the greatest domestic manager of recent times. Yet he had a very dodgy start at Man Utd. Think it may have lasted more than a season. If he had been at Norwich with these reactions would he have stood a chance. 

As Morty says we need to have realistic expectations and give the guy a chance.

 

[RhythmicTheory]

Agree with you Sussex, I know others didn't agree but I've seen plenty of hysteria over this and various sites so far and its far too early.  Given our injuries there's a good chance we end up having to use the same midfield again this weekend (which frightens me!).  Although they each had differing levels of experience, 2 managers now have failed with this group of players and third has seen similar consistency problems at the start of this reign.  When does it become the players and not the managers?  Anyway getting off message here, I dont think we will see what and how Alex wants to do for a while yet, which is why I think play offs is the best we can hope for.

Bethnal Y n G posted this link on this twitter, gives a little insight into what you can expect, league differences not with standing:

http://inbedwithmaradona.com/journal/2012/11/12/hamilton-academical-the-future-of-scottish-football-is-here.html

I think peoples feelings have just been compounded (rightly) by Phelan leaving, when it was stated all along hes part of the team (so whats changed).

Back room organisation wise, this season has been a disaster in all honesty, from the mis adventures in Italy to appointments leaving before they've even started.  Thank god we are in the champ, we would be a laughing stock in the prem.

 

[Canaryboy]

Alex Neil said that he was about to bring Grabban on before our red card, so make of that what you will, was Phelan really running things until the 69th minute? 

 

[Dubai Mark]

Right now I agree with Morty, that is, based on whats happened so far and where we now find ourselves, then a play-off would be a good achievement......hard for me to accept and say after my original expectations, but is actually spot on!  

 

[Paul Handscombe]

In answer to the question who would I have played in centre midfield.

Murphy

Mcgrandles

Bennett (wiht murphy on wing)

Hoolahan

Played a 3 5 2 with wing backs of Olson and Bennet

Played a diamond with Johnson at the base one of Murphy Mcgrandles Bennett Hoolahan Laferty Murphy as the centre and then Hoolahan Laferty Grabban Murphy as the top of the diamond

Anything but what he did.

Would anyone have played Whitaker there?? Seriously??

 

[eatonparkboy]

Okay pedants, a 50% win rate it is then 

Has it really got to do with points only? The football served up by AN for the last three halves has been nothing short of awful. It has nothing to do with panic buttons. Taking one game at a time, AN is worse than NA. Win the next two or three with good football and he will be better.

 

[Beauseant]

I actually feel optimistic, but that's probably because I didn't buy into the idea that we had a divine right to bounce back. We have a number of players whose attitudes are wrong and they've shown that under Adams, Phelan and Neil (Reading home, Reading away, Brentford home) so the hysterical reaction to Saturday in terms of making snap judgements on Neil is exactly that. Its easy to say Player X or Y would have done better than Whittaker because they didn't play so they can be as brilliant as a poster's fevered imaginations wants to make them.

Look at the choices to partner BJ. A 19 year old with 14 minutes Championship experience, a lightweight, one footed defensive liability, a winger who's one outing as a central midfielder (in a Capital Cup match) was disastrous or an experienced Scottish international who has played CM on a number of occasions for Rangers. It's hardly surprising that he went for Whittaker.

The squad needs to be rebuilt and that will take time, but it's being put on the backburner due to the obsession with bouncing back. If we don't go up this year the sun will still rise in the mornings and we'll have an exciting young manager with a clear vision free to build the team he wants, not try to flog some commitment out of a bunch of players with delusions of grandeur. Have you any idea how awful this squad would be in the Prem? We'd rival Derby for the lowest points total, even with a few million quids worth of reinforcements because this squad has no heart.

 

[ZLF]

Agree completely with that Beauseant;  claiming the others were better options is just hindsighting.   

And having BJ as your one fixed cm option is also starting from a weak premise;  he does not seem to be able to curb his attacking enthusiasm and whoever his partner was left us weak in a key area of the pitch.    BJ covers a huge amount of ground but is an ineffective def cm - and his sparkling performances at left midfield show where he can give us more benefit and less liability.

 

[RhythmicTheory]

Spot on Beauseant.  If you dont mind me asking, do you have any inside information to share?  (You always seemed to be in touch with people in the know previously)

 

[RhythmicTheory]

BJ is b2b midfielder at best, he doesnt have the discipline (or the intelligence tbh) to operate as an anchor.  He does have a hell of a left foot shot though.  I dont rate BJ but he will always give his all for the team, just need to place him where his liabilities dont cost us (something Adams worked masterfully laterly).

 

[Beauseant]

I pick up the odd thing that slips through the shroud of secrecy at Carrow Road. Anything that I can post I do, but some things have to stay out of the public domain. At present, there isn't much info to share as not much is happening!