That John Ruddy question.....

[Din]

Ruddy is a great keeper, the only thing with him is he does make the odd sloppy mistake per game. Most of the time it doesn't matter, but every now and then, for example Newcastle's 2nd goal on Saturday, it does have an effect. As a shot stopper he's superb, and I'd keep him in the side for a good few games yet. I think people forget that at times so far this season he's kept us in games.

That all said, Rudd does look like an excellent goalkeeper. And should Ruddy become any more sloppy then Rudd would deserve a shot.

 

[GJP]

Ruddy is a great keeper, the only thing with him is he does make the odd sloppy mistake per game. 

That doesn't sound like a "great" 'keeper.

 

[Canaryboy]

John Ruddy's inconsistent form seems to have coincided in part with David Watson leaving in summer 2014, or possibly Tony Parks leaving in February 2015, is Dean Kiely up to the job? That's one question we have to ask. Didn't come with the experience of Watson or Parks. 

Although truthfully I don't think he has ever been quite the same since his injury in the 2012/13 season. Up until that injury he looked worthy of England caps, none of us could believe that Ben Foster was above him in the pecking order, and none of us even thought to mention that his predecessor Fraser Forster was doing well. We considered John Ruddy to be the 2nd best English keeper beneath Joe Hart at that stage, or at least joint 3rd with Forster. 

Now I'm not so sure that we'd set him apart from Foster, Heaton, Butland, etc, and remains to be seen if Forster has the same issue recapturing his form after a year out.  

I wonder whether being taken out of the firing line for a little while is actually the best course of action if he continues to struggle for form. It worked for Joe Hart when he had a confidence crisis.

 

[Wiz]

If Ruddy's confidence is shot then he has to be dropped.

 

[It's Character Forming]

I agree that I don't think he's been quite the same since his injury a few seasons back - before then I really felt he could go on to play for England, now being honest I don't think he's in contention for the England squad.

Taking the Liverpool game as an example, I felt he did well and it was a solid goalkeeping performance, but there were none of the saves that I thought were really impressive - with all of them, I would have been disappointed if he hadn't made the save.  For Sunday it would be harsh to single him out for criticism but again he didn't make any saves that were impressive.

The only time I've seen Rudd play recently was against Rotherham and he was under plenty of pressure for much of that game and pulled off several saves that I felt were spectacular including one diving at full stretch.  I have to confess there were more than a couple of the saves which I thought to myself "Ruddy probably wouldn't have got that".  And he also looked very comfortable and commanding in the area, against a side with quite a few big strong players - more comfortable IMO than Ruddy had looked when we played them late last season and they put in a lot of crosses.

So while I'm not keen on dropping a keeper as a knee jerk reaction, I'm now wondering whether it's about time for Rudd to get a chance in the first team.  He's not exactly a youngster any more - I was surprised to notice him in the squad for our L1 season when I looked at it over the summer, so he's been with us a long time now !

 

[Beauseant]

I agree that I don't think he's been quite the same since his injury a few seasons back - before then I really felt he could go on to play for England, now being honest I don't think he's in contention for the England squad.

Taking the Liverpool game as an example, I felt he did well and it was a solid goalkeeping performance, but there were none of the saves that I thought were really impressive - with all of them, I would have been disappointed if he hadn't made the save.  For Sunday it would be harsh to single him out for criticism but again he didn't make any saves that were impressive.

The only time I've seen Rudd play recently was against Rotherham and he was under plenty of pressure for much of that game and pulled off several saves that I felt were spectacular including one diving at full stretch.  I have to confess there were more than a couple of the saves which I thought to myself "Ruddy probably wouldn't have got that".  And he also looked very comfortable and commanding in the area, against a side with quite a few big strong players - more comfortable IMO than Ruddy had looked when we played them late last season and they put in a lot of crosses.

So while I'm not keen on dropping a keeper as a knee jerk reaction, I'm now wondering whether it's about time for Rudd to get a chance in the first team.  He's not exactly a youngster any more - I was surprised to notice him in the squad for our L1 season when I looked at it over the summer, so he's been with us a long time now !

And this post sums up why this is such an excellent forum. Had this debate occurred on the Pink'un we would by now have had numerous insults, references back to long held grudges and digressions to allow a poster to have a swipe at someone he or she doesn't like.

Instead we have considered, intelligent analysis and polite disagreement. Brilliant!

 

[Gaffer]

I don't see why people think that keepers have to be having a nightmare run of games to be dropped. If an outfield player has a few mediocre games (like Bradley Johnson) they get dropped and have to win their place back, so why not the same with keepers? People talk about the odd mistake but that's what separates a great keeper from a good one. It's not like being a striker where you can miss a sitter but then go and score a hat trick of spectacular goals. People say things like Butland saved the game for them but that's exactly what Premier League keepers should be doing. Newcastle had 6 shots on target and scored 6 goals. Even if Ruddy wasn't at fault for any of them you would expect a PL keeper to make at least one save. So why not give a Rudd a chance? He'd benefit from the games and Ruddy would benefit from the pressure being lifted.

 

[Dubai Mark]

Gaffer, put that way, then I start to reconsider a tatch,  

 

[Canaryboy]

I don't see why people think that keepers have to be having a nightmare run of games to be dropped. If an outfield player has a few mediocre games (like Bradley Johnson) they get dropped and have to win their place back, so why not the same with keepers? People talk about the odd mistake but that's what separates a great keeper from a good one. It's not like being a striker where you can miss a sitter but then go and score a hat trick of spectacular goals. People say things like Butland saved the game for them but that's exactly what Premier League keepers should be doing. Newcastle had 6 shots on target and scored 6 goals. Even if Ruddy wasn't at fault for any of them you would expect a PL keeper to make at least one save. So why not give a Rudd a chance? He'd benefit from the games and Ruddy would benefit from the pressure being lifted.

I don't disagree with what you have said, but do question whether this is the right time to put Rudd in for his first run of senior games, with such a tough run of fixtures coming up. 

And I still think Ruddy has had more good games than bad ones this season. If given the choice between dropping Ruddy or breaking up that Martin-Whittaker partnership then I'd choose the latter right now. 

I'll be cheesed off if our back 5 is unchanged against West Brom, Wisdom needs to come in at the very least, for either one of Martin or Whittaker.  

 

[hogesar]

And this post sums up why this is such an excellent forum. Had this debate occurred on the Pink'un we would by now have had numerous insults, references back to long held grudges and digressions to allow a poster to have a swipe at someone he or she doesn't like.

Instead we have considered, intelligent analysis and polite disagreement. Brilliant!

To be fair, there is a thread on Ruddy on the PinkUn with 123 replies, and has generally speaking also been a good debate.

 

[Beauseant]

I was generalising mate. I accept there are some sensible threads on there, but they tend to be in the minority.

 

[Killiecanary]

I think it is time for John Ruddy to have a rest.  I felt he was at fault for the equaliser at WHU, conceded 6 goals from 6 shots on target at Newcatsle (2 of which I felt he should have done better with) and looked out of sorts on Saturday (although not at fault for the goal he looks to be clearly lacking in confidence)  - personally I think he has been inconsistent since returning from injury.

for me the cup tie at Everton is nicely timed.  If Rudd plays as well as he has in the previous outings this season, then I can see him putting pressure on JR for the jersey on Saturday.  Which I think will be good for JR as we'll in all honesty.

declan is now in his early 20s - he can't sit on our bench his entire career.  Personally I think he deserves a start now.  If he doesn't get one when JR is not performing to the standards he has set in the last (and as gaffer neatly summaries above we should expect from a Premier League goalkeeper) then when is he? 

 

[Dubai Mark]

So, Rudd plays vs Everton, has a great game and takes Ruddy's place for the Citeh game........."what if" they do what they have been doing at home so far and notch a hatfull, will that not rock a young keeper like Rudd's confidence just a bit to much? On the flip side, he could put in a stormer and win a point for us by having a Butland type of match....there again so could John Ruddy do either.....bet you are all glad you havnt got to pick the team!!   

 

[Personal Trainer]

My feeling is that Ruddy is fine with the sort of flying save he made on Saturday but watching him from the Lower Barclay, just behind the goal, he does seem slow at getting down to ground shots. I don't think we need to mention cutting out crosses but then it wasn't Gunnys forte either. 

 

[Killiecanary]

So, Rudd plays vs Everton, has a great game and takes Ruddy's place for the Citeh game........."what if" they do what they have been doing at home so far and notch a hatfull, will that not rock a young keeper like Rudd's confidence just a bit to much? On the flip side, he could put in a stormer and win a point for us by having a Butland type of match....there again so could John Ruddy do either.....bet you are all glad you havnt got to pick the team!!   

All fair points Mark...apart from the fact that I don't see Declan Rudd as a young keeper anymore.  He has a successful couple of lower league seasons behind him - if we aren't willing to play him when the guy he has been patiently waiting behind is out of form (which I do believe he is) then when do we? 

 

[Killiecanary]

That question is becoming urgent now.  Wasn't just the penalty (quite horrific thought that moment was) but generally it was pretty clear the defence have very little confidence in him right now...there were several moments where Ruddy came and flapped or came and the defender took the ball away from him.  For me he needs a rest and Declan Rudd needs to be given a chance.  

 

[Dubai Mark]

I need to watch the game again as I didnt see an horrific performance from Ruddy, but did see two keepers make one error each, and one is England's No.1?

 

[KeiranShikari]

There were a couple of times where I thought John Ruddy could have been more vocal today as well as the big error but yeah, it would be harsh to drop him right now.He and the rest of the team aren't in the greatest of form right now but I don't think we need wholesale changes, we've looked decent since Mulumbu's return. Can't see this losing run going on too much longer.

 

[Killiecanary]

I counted another three times apart from the penalty incident where JR either came for the ball and a defender took it away from him or where a defender was looking round waiting for him to come to claim a fairly obvious goalkeepers ball and he didn't.  I think that his confidence is shot to bits, and still feel he needs to be dropped.  I don't know if Declan is going to be good enough to be a premier league goalkeeper but I do feel it is time we found out.  By the way I am not a JR hater - at his best he was great for us.  I just don't think he has been anywhere near there for a good while now.   But for me, the manager needs to pick the best / most in form player for each position, and that includes the last line of defence.

 

[Canaryboy]

Ruddy needs to be taken out of the firing line for 3 or 4 weeks, he is simply playing nervously and making mistakes as a result, today he panicked. 

Joe Hart has been dropped in the past, Brad Guzan was dropped for a while at the end of last season. The kindest thing to do is to take him out of the firing line for a few weeks, we've got an adequate deputy who looks to be playing with confidence at the moment. 

Ruddy is a quality keeper but needs a break.