In or Out?

[Warren Hill]

Not forgetting Big Ron Atkinson, Graham Taylor and Howard Wilkinson.

Anyone know what Herbert Chapman is up to these days..?

Let's be honest it would need to be someone recently enough involved to be able to exert some sort of influence, to that end Royle looked a decent fit but I'm not sure about any of those names being suggested. Hodgson would have been a good call but I think he's busy...

 

[Yellow Fever]

They are two totally different scenarios though. With Lambert our success was perhaps unexpected, and I think that, considering what had happened previously, most people considered we would be in the Championship a few seasons. So peoples expectations were somewhat lower.

We find ourselves now in a considerably better financial position, pockets bulging with parachute payments, and quite rightly setting our expectations higher. We were top of the league a few weeks ago, and now we're tenth. Sorry, this is looking less like a blip to me, and more like a worrying, downward trend. We look incredibly fragile. 

So what you're suggesting, Morty, is that though the results for this season match those of Lambert's Championship season, that doesn't matter? I'm more than a little confused by that. Lambert's team eventually improved from that position to gain automatic promotion, but Adams' team seems to you to be on a 'downward trend' so there is no possibility of improvement, in spite of two winnable home games coming up. Isn't that just a little subjective? City looked anything but 'fragile' in the first half with crisp passing and movement, but that doesn't matter because things went wrong in the second half? I agree that things need to improve, but unlike you, I think that is very possible with the squad we have over the season as a whole. I can't see any reason why we can't still gain promotion with two thirds of the season to go. 

 

[morty]

So what you're suggesting, Morty, is that though the results for this season match those of Lambert's Championship season, that doesn't matter? I'm more than a little confused by that. Lambert's team eventually improved from that position to gain automatic promotion, but Adams' team seems to you to be on a 'downward trend' so there is no possibility of improvement, in spite of two winnable home games coming up. Isn't that just a little subjective? City looked anything but 'fragile' in the first half with crisp passing and movement, but that doesn't matter because things went wrong in the second half? I agree that things need to improve, but unlike you, I think that is very possible with the squad we have over the season as a whole. I can't see any reason why we can't still gain promotion with two thirds of the season to go. 

I didn't say there wasn't the possibility of improvement, of course there is, but with every game we lose, it makes it all the harder to catch up.

We are talking in the context of the two managers. With the position the club was in at the time, the points total was acceptable. With the far greater (financial and quality of squad) position we hold now, the points tally is less acceptable. And I don't think the Championship was particularly good quality that season, either.

Games aren't won in first halves, they are won over 90 minutes. I put it to you, that there are very few games that we have won comfortably this season, I stand by my point of an inherent fragility.

I am not some merchant of doom, I was one of the last people I know to eventually concede Hughton wasn't up to the job, but I know when things aren't quite right, and I know the look of a manager who is wondering how the hell he is going to sort it out. Publically blaming the players wasn't his smartest of moves either.

 

[Killiecanary]

I have no Problem with him having a dig at the players Mort. They are professionals and are making mistakes that I wouldn't be happy if my under 11 team make, especially defensively! I know you're not a doom-monger, and I agree (as always) with most of what you say. The question for me isn't about so much what's gone wrong in the past month,as all teams have tough patches, but does the manager have the necessary experience, talent, motivational skills and tactical acumen to turn it back around and take us on a winning run.

Unfortunately I am lacking confidence currently that he has. I suspect he has two or three games max to turn it around.

 

[morty]

I have no Problem with him having a dig at the players Mort. They are professionals and are making mistakes that I wouldn't be happy if my under 11 team make, especially defensively! I know you're not a doom-monger, and I agree (as always) with most of what you say. The question for me isn't about so much what's gone wrong in the past month,as all teams have tough patches, but does the manager have the necessary experience, talent, motivational skills and tactical acumen to turn it back around and take us on a winning run.

Unfortunately I am lacking confidence currently that he has. I suspect he has two or three games max to turn it around.

I would have preferred had he shouldered a bit more of the blame personally. Everyone who was around me at the match could see what was happening, we all knew a Forest goal was only a matter of time, the game was crying out for a change.

Post game he looked like a rabbit in the headlights.

I agree, two or three games, but as someone else on here said, he is getting dangerously close to losing the fans already.

 

[Killiecanary]

I hope the fans give him a fair go for the time being. He deserves that as long as the board keep him in post. I would hate for someone as popular and important in our history to end up like Gunny. If the team can sort themselves out he can still save this I think, if he was to pick up say 10 points from the next 4 games the fans would be back onside (until the next blip)

But if he can't deliver those Improvements before Christmas, then I agree it could get ugly...

 

[Lowestoft Canary]

Adams credibility is shot I don't think there is any way back for him.

 

[morty]

I hope the fans give him a fair go for the time being. He deserves that as long as the board keep him in post. I would hate for someone as popular and important in our history to end up like Gunny. If the team can sort themselves out he can still save this I think, if he was to pick up say 10 points from the next 4 games the fans would be back onside (until the next blip)

But if he can't deliver those Improvements before Christmas, then I agree it could get ugly...

I honestly don't think its a fickle thing, in respect of fans crying just because we lose a game or two. Do you go to away games at all? This is where I find you really get a feel for how fans are feeling, in the bars and concourses, pre, mid and post game. And people are concerned. The away fans were pretty subdued on Saturday, even though we were one nil up, because no one had confidence that we could see the game out, which of course proved to be the case.

 

[morty]

Adams credibility is shot I don't think there is any way back for him.

I disagree. If he can turn things around and start winning games then there is a way back. But he needs to do it real soon...

 

[the bristolnest]

In.Unless we can get Eddie Howe

 

[Personal Trainer]

Haven't got an answer to the question, but, excluding money-bags QPR, it seems to me that most successful Championship teams evolve into winners by building up a team layer by layer. Hate to say it but Ipswich look to have done this.

If, as is likely we miss out this season it may be time to build around the younger fringe players like Miquel who are languishing in the U21 side. I think I could live with that but not sure if Club could financially.

 

[Warren Hill]

Let me get this right; the secretary of the supporters trust is advocating that we model ourselves on and be more like Ipswich Town?

That'll bring new members to the trust in their droves!! Jesus wept.

 

[Personal Trainer]

Let me get this right; the secretary of the supporters trust is advocating that we model ourselves on and be more like Ipswich Town?

That'll bring new members to the trust in their droves!! Jesus wept.

I do not post on here as any sort of spokesperson on behalf of the Trust except when the Trust is the topic under discussion. I am entitled to my personal views as a NCFC fan.

I am not saying we should model ourselves on anybody, think the club have been down that route, Charlton, West Brom etc and we know where that leads. What I was trying to say, clumsily maybe, is that it is often the case that Clubs who get into the PL have taken two or three years to build a successful side. At present Ipswich are doing better than us without, as their manager continually tells anyone who will listen, two pennies to rub together. 

 

[Warren Hill]

I'd politely suggest that if you don't want your posts to reflect on the Trust, then TrustSec might not be the best username.

With regard to the point on Ipswich; they might be currently above us in the League standings and I appreciate that doesn't sit well, especially given the gulf between the two sides when we played BUT are you honestly suggesting that you'd swap any aspect of our club with theirs? Playing staff, Board level, finances, assets? Personally, I think we'll finish above them, don't you? I think it's a bit early to be gazing down the A140 enviously just because they've snuck into a play off position after a third of a season.

 

[Yellow Fever]

Getting back to the OP, I find it strange that no one on here is talking about the risks involved in changing managers. Fulham and Cardiff have done it and are still struggling. Unless you're a club like Fulham, once you sack the manager you've lost that option for the rest of the season. Change isn't always for the better.

 

[Trevmuttley]

I'm afraid NA should stand down, something has gone wrong ever since the cup exit its all gone downhill and as they are quick to point out they don't become bad players overnight. So what is it those players out there have been and seen it all before so they know how to win matches, we need something to happen or we will see that village team down the A140 get in to the promised land and we will be left wanting.

 

[eatonparkboy]

Not forgetting Big Ron Atkinson, Graham Taylor and Howard Wilkinson.

Anyone know what Herbert Chapman is up to these days..?

Let's be honest it would need to be someone recently enough involved to be able to exert some sort of influence, to that end Royle looked a decent fit but I'm not sure about any of those names being suggested. Hodgson would have been a good call but I think he's busy...

Why somebody recent? If they are recent then they are out of work so their CV might not be worth typing out again. And Hodgson has never had a50% win ratio in this country so I don't know how he keeps getting top jobs. Is he a Mason?

 

[Personal Trainer]

I'd politely suggest that if you don't want your posts to reflect on the Trust, then TrustSec might not be the best username.

With regard to the point on Ipswich; they might be currently above us in the League standings and I appreciate that doesn't sit well, especially given the gulf between the two sides when we played BUT are you honestly suggesting that you'd swap any aspect of our club with theirs? Playing staff, Board level, finances, assets? Personally, I think we'll finish above them, don't you? I think it's a bit early to be gazing down the A140 enviously just because they've snuck into a play off position after a third of a season.

Good point re name but when you get to my age usernames are like passwords - easily forgotten!!!

Regarding the infrastucture and transparency of the two clubs there is no comparison, City will always top that argument.

Right time to find a new name!

 

[Personal Trainer]

Just read an article in the Guardian Sport about Jose Riga and how he was sacked at Blackpool but wants to stay managing in England. Interesting to know if he is on the fans "radar".

 

[Warren Hill]

Eatonparkboy, my personal feeling is that someone recent would have more relevance to today's game and because of that might elicit a more positive response from the players.

As for Hodgson, I think he's somebody that the majority shareholders trust, has a wealth of experience both here and internationally and would have been a perfect fit.