I Don't Understand

[Monty13]

I agree.

When IP board 4.0 arrives and I have to do a redesign (which I'm planning to do by the way), I will be seeking to reduce the number of forums to 5 or 6. One forum titled 'Non-football' will suffice, for example.  

The current set-up has a way of making this place look much less active than it actually is.

I genuinely feel one forum with a clear indication of the nature of each topic is the future for usability, but its not my forum.

I'm afraid I never look at the other forums, I'm sure I'm not the only one, so even reducing the number of them will not stop my one click nature. If you want me to click in and out of different forums to view what's being discussed I'm just not going to do it.

 

[morty]

I genuinely feel one forum with a clear indication of the nature of each topic is the future for usability, but its not my forum.

I'm afraid I never look at the other forums, I'm sure I'm not the only one, so even reducing the number of them will not stop my one click nature. If you want me to click in and out of different forums to view what's being discussed I'm just not going to do it.

I disagree, I think the current 6 football forums, with maybe one other for everything else would be fine.

We are primarily here to talk about Norwich City and football.

And trawling through one forum past threads about cats and one direction, really wouldn't be for me.

 

[Canaryboy]

I genuinely feel one forum with a clear indication of the nature of each topic is the future for usability, but its not my forum.

I've seen football forums which follow the one board format and it is difficult to tell that they are football forums, next time I come across one I'll show you precisely why it is necessary to at least have a non-football board for non-football topics. 

Perhaps by creating a single 'non-football' board we'll see it become more active?

The problem with this: "clear indication of the nature of the topic" is that it would mean more work for me. There is already a way to do this, with a prefix, but when somebody starts a thread and doesn't remember to use a prefix.... it will be me having to edit each thread title to include the prefix (pre-fix example from this board: 'match thread'). 

I do like the way that VillaTalk use the player prefix for threads about current players though, and the legend prefix for threads about former players, because we could probably do something similar to move 'current players' and 'former players' on the main board, as long as there was an easy way to find the threads (a prefix list in the sidebar to bring up a list of such threads, for example). 

Those current player threads are supposed to be an easy way to say something about a player without starting a new thread, but would probably be used more if they were bumped up the main board when somebody does so. 

But I'll have to see how the new software is set up, because we are talking about something which could work on this current version but the new version may have even better ways to control stuff, will have to see, I'm excited about the new version though. 

Can see no point in investing any time at all into this current version if it is going to become redundant, particularly as time is at a premium for me at the moment (as you all know, ha). 

It will be good to work in consultation with the users though, for ideas / opinions etc. Hopefully NorwichTalk 2.0 can be a huge improvement. It certainly will be for smartphone users who have to put up with that mobile app! 

 

[morty]

I don't think theres a lot wrong with the format we have now. If I see a new post in a forum, I'll pop in and read it, and the layout means it is particularly easy to see the post has been made, and to read it.

I like the current and ex player threads, it keeps the main forum tidier.

 

[Monty13]

I don't think theres a lot wrong with the format we have now. If I see a new post in a forum, I'll pop in and read it, and the layout means it is particularly easy to see the post has been made, and to read it.

I like the current and ex player threads, it keeps the main forum tidier.

I'm going to agree to disagree.

It may be neat but there's a reason the subforums are used much less. Its all very well the forum being neat but I'd much prefer it to be livelier.

I think a simple football/non football system with all the football prefixed like the villatalk forum would encourage much more interaction and a healthier level of participation.

You have a community, why not ask them? I've expressed my views, but they are my views, the majority may be happy with the current format. I personally find it clunky so only keep an eye on the main forum, but I concede I may be in the minority.

 

[Monty13]

I've seen football forums which follow the one board format and it is difficult to tell that they are football forums, next time I come across one I'll show you precisely why it is necessary to at least have a non-football board for non-football topics.

Perhaps by creating a single 'non-football' board we'll see it become more active?

The problem with this: "clear indication of the nature of the topic" is that it would mean more work for me. There is already a way to do this, with a prefix, but when somebody starts a thread and doesn't remember to use a prefix.... it will be me having to edit each thread title to include the prefix (pre-fix example from this board: 'match thread').

I do like the way that VillaTalk use the player prefix for threads about current players though, and the legend prefix for threads about former players, because we could probably do something similar to move 'current players' and 'former players' on the main board, as long as there was an easy way to find the threads (a prefix list in the sidebar to bring up a list of such threads, for example).

Those current player threads are supposed to be an easy way to say something about a player without starting a new thread, but would probably be used more if they were bumped up the main board when somebody does so.

But I'll have to see how the new software is set up, because we are talking about something which could work on this current version but the new version may have even better ways to control stuff, will have to see, I'm excited about the new version though.

Can see no point in investing any time at all into this current version if it is going to become redundant, particularly as time is at a premium for me at the moment (as you all know, ha).

It will be good to work in consultation with the users though, for ideas / opinions etc. Hopefully NorwichTalk 2.0 can be a huge improvement. It certainly will be for smartphone users who have to put up with that mobile app!

Lol, read morty's post first! Like all of this. I think the ideas you talk about would be a big improvement to user friendliness.
Is there a way you can force people to apply a prefix to their thread?

 

[eatonparkboy]

But we now have three pages of posts on a subject that has now evolved into a discussion about the format of the site. I don't think there is too much wrong with that in itself.

But I do think threads can be overlong when they amount to five or six pages and that is mainly because we are all repeating what someone else has said or trying to make a point against someone who is intransigent on that particular point. Unless challenged, it would probably be pertinent to maximise posts about off topics.

Obviously posters pop into match threads at the last page whereas more "laborious" and researched topics have to be read from the start.

 

[morty]

I'm going to agree to disagree.

It may be neat but there's a reason the subforums are used much less. Its all very well the forum being neat but I'd much prefer it to be livelier.

I think a simple football/non football system with all the football prefixed like the villatalk forum would encourage much more interaction and a healthier level of participation.

You have a community, why not ask them? I've expressed my views, but they are my views, the majority may be happy with the current format. I personally find it clunky so only keep an eye on the main forum, but I concede I may be in the minority.

About 95% of the forum traffic here is on this forum, the other forums really don't detract very much at all from the overall business of the place. Perhaps the reason the subforums are used less is that people primarily come here to talk about Norwich City?

Lol, theres nothing clunky whatsoever about this place whatsoever, I think you know where I'd point you if you wanted to see clunky.

 

[hogesar]

I will never want Norwich City to lose regardless of any circumstance....I do not even predict a defeat or bet against us, just doesnt feel right. I tend to agree with your comment Morty, although am of the view that any success we will get this season now will be despite having NA as manager...thats just how I feel right now....

Don't follow the 'despite Adams' logic.

If we succeed at he's our manager at the time he deserves as much praise for turning it around as anyone.

The hilarity began on Saturday when the team was announced and Social Media was bombarded with "AWFUL TEAM ADAMS OUT" in about 934894 different variations.

Now of course, when we won, it became "YES MIKE PHELAN IS HAVING AN IMPACT!".

Bizarre. 

 

[hogesar]

I'm going to agree to disagree.

It may be neat but there's a reason the subforums are used much less. Its all very well the forum being neat but I'd much prefer it to be livelier.

I think a simple football/non football system with all the football prefixed like the villatalk forum would encourage much more interaction and a healthier level of participation.

You have a community, why not ask them? I've expressed my views, but they are my views, the majority may be happy with the current format. I personally find it clunky so only keep an eye on the main forum, but I concede I may be in the minority.

From an IT background, you are incredibly correct.

User's, bar the odd exception, are very lazy. They want to see everything they want doing the least possible. Why do companies pay tens of thousands on SEO just to get them in the top 10 google search results? Because about 80% of people won't click the second page to see the next list of results.

So this forum is a bit...anti-user. It's very well organised and i know how to get to what I want but i have to do more than i should to get there.

In my view, there should be a NCFC Main Discussion Board, a Non-Football Board, and an Announcements Board. At maximum. No sub-forums in there either. 

It's sad because the site here is well laid out but the above is a reality, i'm afraid.

 

[Monty13]

About 95% of the forum traffic here is on this forum, the other forums really don't detract very much at all from the overall business of the place. Perhaps the reason the subforums are used less is that people primarily come here to talk about Norwich City?

Lol, theres nothing clunky whatsoever about this place whatsoever, I think you know where I'd point you if you wanted to see clunky.

Don't get me wrong, I know what you're saying and yes the place we shall not name is a terrible example.

But while this place is slicker and more modern in styling, it is setup the same way. The format does not really differ, only the usability. It is not a critisism of this forum over others, but more that there are slicker ways of presenting what's on offer.

My point to you would be why if 95% of the traffic is on this one forum do we have several other forums? That makes little sense. What your saying is actually 90% or so of the real estate isn't realy being used. So why have it?

People come here to talk about Norwich City but they may hang around more if talking about other stuff with like minded individuals was easier. Why have a transfer forum? that's Norwich city related, so are past and present players, instead of moving threads why not just keep the debate where 95% of the people are?

 

[Yellow Fever]

I prefer the transfer forum being kept separate although I contribute to both. It also helps to avoid duplicate threads. It works well here, but strangely it hs never worked on the Pink'un Board.

 

[Monty13]

I prefer the transfer forum being kept separate although I contribute to both. It also helps to avoid duplicate threads. It works well here, but strangely it hs never worked on the Pink'un Board.

I personally like all the Norwich related stuff in one place, when its transfer season there is usually little else to talk about. I think the best way to stop duplicate threads is always going to be having only one place to put something.

I do agree with Morty though that non football stuff should be separate to football, I don't want cats and politics mixed in with football either. But I don't personally understand the rationale for all the football stuff not being in the same place if its clearly marked, the villatalk website is a pretty good example of something close to that.

 

[The Great Mass Debater]

I personally like all the Norwich related stuff in one place, when its transfer season there is usually little else to talk about. I think the best way to stop duplicate threads is always going to be having only one place to put something.

I do agree with Morty though that non football stuff should be separate to football, I don't want cats and politics mixed in with football either. But I don't personally understand the rationale for all the football stuff not being in the same place if its clearly marked, the villatalk website is a pretty good example of something close to that.

Issue with having separate forums by topic is that people dont come here to talk politics. There's a difference between logging on and thinking 'oh I fancy a discussion about politics' or it just naturally cropping up as part of the conversation. I made this thread political by making an analogy. If Id have gone onto the politics forum and started a new thread saying, 'hey who wants to discuss politics?!' nothing would have happened.

I think the sub-forums are never going to get people using them to deliberately talk about these things - as otherwise they'd log onto a politics forum, or a cats and one direction forum as Morty puts it. But they could be a reservoir for people to continue discussions which have gone off topic and people have ended up talking about something they didnt intend to - kind of in the way the old match threads go into an archive.

We have an online community, but as Morty says, we're all here to talk about football so wont come here to deliberately talk about something else (generally)

 

[Monty13]

Issue with having separate forums by topic is that people dont come here to talk politics. There's a difference between logging on and thinking 'oh I fancy a discussion about politics' or it just naturally cropping up as part of the conversation. I made this thread political by making an analogy. If Id have gone onto the politics forum and started a new thread saying, 'hey who wants to discuss politics?!' nothing would have happened.

I think the sub-forums are never going to get people using them to deliberately talk about these things - as otherwise they'd log onto a politics forum, or a cats and one direction forum as Morty puts it. But they could be a reservoir for people to continue discussions which have gone off topic and people have ended up talking about something they didnt intend to - kind of in the way the old match threads go into an archive.

We have an online community, but as Morty says, we're all here to talk about football so wont come here to deliberately talk about something else (generally)

I agree completely, I think a non football forum where anything that goes off topic into a non football related discussion could be moved to is an excellent idea.

That way existing interesting conversations could continue without annoying those not interested.

You're entirely right and you've put it in a way that makes total sense, we don't come here to discuss non football issues, but conversations that tangent off into them should have an area to carry on in.

 

[Yellow Fever]

I've no strong feelings about mixing transfer threads on the main forum, though the 'Next Unread Topic' option is useful for running through all the transfer threads in one go. Whatever happens, this will always be the best Board around!

 

[Yellow Fever]

I notice that although rumours have emerged about Redmond and Ruddy, no one has picked them up on the transfer thread.

 

[Surgeryman]

The problem with this analogy is that our national debt has increased more in the past 4 years than it did in the 13 years previous under Labour, because the Conservatives strategy was reliant on a growth in tax revenues which were overly optimistic. Labour's plan was to borrow in order to try and stimulate growth and increase tax revenues. Both had the same objective, to decrease the deficit. One by increasing income, one by decreasing expenditure. 

A better analogy would be whether we stick with Adams in the sheer hope that our performance improves sufficiently whilst cutting our costs (Conservative strategy) but may find that it doesn't, or take a punt on investing in in an experienced manager in the belief that it would improve performance and result in prosperity (promotion), but may find that it doesn't and could backfire financially (Labour strategy). Both options involve not much more than a massive gamble, and both have the possibility of worsening our position (debt could increase as a result of sticking with Adams and failing to win promotion, debt could increase even further by shelling out on a big name manager and investing in the squad, without promotion). Both are a risk, and the failure of either is a disaster. 

Lets remember that the Tories promised to wipe out the deficit over this 5 year parliament. Instead they merely halved it, from £150bn to £72bn, which is higher than it was for all but 1 of Labour's 13 years in power, and we ironically voted out one of the few chancellors we've ever had who had successfully run a budget surplus for multiple consecutive years (before Tony Blair got us into an expensive war, which put paid to that). 

Well put across . Cant stand neo liberal ideology!

 

[Surgeryman]

Russell Brand's views on the economy for what its worth...

Russell Brand sums up all that is wrong in this country. Talentless buffoon.

 

[Surgeryman]

3-1 to us tomorrow though!