lyb
Active Member
By the sounds of it you’d have been arguing not to waste lives on fighting him either.
Why should we worry about Poland being invaded, after all?
Why should we worry about Poland being invaded, after all?
morty
Moderator
Staff member
I look forward to you volunteering for the military.
Always easy to want other people to die for "principals", eh?
Putin will not invade Poland, don't be so stupid.
Always easy to want other people to die for "principals", eh?
Putin will not invade Poland, don't be so stupid.
morty
Moderator
Staff member
And as for your first point, yeah I'm quite the pacifist / coward. That spent 22 years in the military.
You absolute spoon.
You absolute spoon.
lyb
Active Member
So how did that work exactly? Did you pick and choose your deployments? Did you sign up not expecting to be deployed anywhere? Were you outraged at people for thinking it was a good idea that you should be deployed somewhere?
Ricardo
Active Member
Loved his dog Blondi, so much that he took it to Argentina with him when he escaped on that Uboat in 1945. (Saw it on the telly so must be true)
lyb
Active Member
All a bit academic anyway, seeing as Russia rules out any peacekeeping forces, so obviously there's no basis for a peace agreement.
lyb
Active Member
Hitler invaded Poland; that's what I'm on about.
I genuinely find your rationale inexplicable. Apparently, it was right to enter WW2 upon Hitler's invasion of Poland when we'd warned that was a red line, but apparently it's wrong for the UK to get involved when Putin invades Poland after Ukraine gave up the third largest nuclear arsenal in the world in exchange for the written guarantees of Russia, the UK, and the US to respect Ukraine's sovereignty.
I just don't understand why you'd be in favour of getting involved thwarting one invasion in 1939, but shrug your shoulders and say 'not our problem' to a conflict that completely undermines non-proliferation of nuclear weapons and commitments regarding nuclear weapons in international law, not to mention just the basic point of another European country being invaded.
I genuinely find your rationale inexplicable. Apparently, it was right to enter WW2 upon Hitler's invasion of Poland when we'd warned that was a red line, but apparently it's wrong for the UK to get involved when Putin invades Poland after Ukraine gave up the third largest nuclear arsenal in the world in exchange for the written guarantees of Russia, the UK, and the US to respect Ukraine's sovereignty.
I just don't understand why you'd be in favour of getting involved thwarting one invasion in 1939, but shrug your shoulders and say 'not our problem' to a conflict that completely undermines non-proliferation of nuclear weapons and commitments regarding nuclear weapons in international law, not to mention just the basic point of another European country being invaded.
morty
Moderator
Staff member
Putin will not invade Poland. Calm the fuck down 
And the two scenarios you are quoting are in no way comparable.
And the two scenarios you are quoting are in no way comparable.
lyb
Active Member
They're in no way comparable? They're completely comparable.
Both were unprovoked invasions of sovereign nations. If anything, the invasion of Ukraine is more outrageous than Hitler's invasion of Poland given Russia, the UK, and US commitments to guarantee Ukraine's sovereign territory in exchange for Ukraine surrendering the third largest nuclear arsenal in existence.
Needless to say there's no way Putin would have invaded Ukraine if it still had a nuclear deterrent. Putin should be damned well thanking us he doesn't have that lot parked on his doorstep, never mind his idiotic paranoia about NATO.
Both were unprovoked invasions of sovereign nations. If anything, the invasion of Ukraine is more outrageous than Hitler's invasion of Poland given Russia, the UK, and US commitments to guarantee Ukraine's sovereign territory in exchange for Ukraine surrendering the third largest nuclear arsenal in existence.
Needless to say there's no way Putin would have invaded Ukraine if it still had a nuclear deterrent. Putin should be damned well thanking us he doesn't have that lot parked on his doorstep, never mind his idiotic paranoia about NATO.
morty
Moderator
Staff member
The same NATO that gave assurances about not expanding, but did anyway?
How I Wrote Elastic Man
Member
I don't see Putin invading Poland right nowPutin will not invade Poland. Calm the fuck down
And the two scenarios you are quoting are in no way comparable.
If it all ends well for him in Ukraine though, maybe the Baltic nations may be next in line?
morty
Moderator
Staff member
I think he knows where the lines are. It's all just a game.
lyb
Active Member
Morty mentioned Hitler; I mentioned Poland in reference to why we entered WW2: The invasion of Poland.
Really didn't dream that would need spelling out. It's GCSE history .
lyb
Active Member
If you were in the military you should know full well that NATO is entirely reactive in nature.
But other than that. Lithuania, Latvia, and Estonia asked to join? Why shouldn't they, especially in the light of Russian sabre rattling bullying it's neighbours. Is their self-determination okay by you?
And how does that remotely negate the fact Ukraine gave up the means to be able to deter Russia itself in return for Russia's lies (and US lies as it turns out).
morty
Moderator
Staff member
I think it is fairly clear that you are only able to see one side of this. I am looking at both sides. And the option where the least people die for a line on a map. Ukrainian and Russian heritage is closely linked, am pretty sure that no Polish folk saw themselves as German in the late 1930's.
lyb
Active Member
What are you? A judge now? Putin's side is bullshit. He invaded and occupied territory of a neighbouring state that is zero threat to Russia purely because it was leaning towards the EU and away from Russia. People like you make every excuse under the sun for him doing so, while laughably advocating for exactly the same sort of appeasement that many advocated for with Hitler invasion after invasion.
It's pretty damn clear you only see Putin's side of it, instead of the side of the hundreds of thousands of Ukrainians forced to flee Ukraine, civilians bombed, chidren kidnapped from their Ukrainian families and rehomed with familites in Russia on the back of a completely unprovoked invasion that as I've stated many times breached a legal commitment to respect it's territory that you clearly ignore as inconvenient to your Putin apologism.
Pretty pathetic. With that attitude I can only imagine you joined the military for the sake of the pay cheque and not any sort of idealism.
morty
Moderator
Staff member
I think we'll leave it there
lyb
Active Member
Seeing as it's all a big joke to you, I guess so.I think we'll leave it there
R
Rock The Boat
Member
Yes, I saw the reel on Youtube. They were talking to this guy over facetime or whatever, and when he mentioned he was from Israel, their nature changed immediately and in a vile and evil way. They said they would kill him if possible and as you reported, claimed they had killed Jews already. They were pure evil. I don't know how anybody could be impressed by evil, lyb, my reaction was one of total disgust.
They will be easy to identify and hopefully the Australian authorities will investigate the case and take the necessary action. Imagine being admitted to a hospital and being treated by a person intent on killing you. Could it happen in our multicultural hospitals? Horrific.