Norwich City vs AFC Bournemouth (away) 16th January 2016

[Killiecanary]

Totally inept performance by the management today. AN tries to do things that can't be done with this line up and squad. Why put Wes out left, a position any NCFC supporter will tell you has been his worst position since he joined in 2008? 

And there is not too much excuse about players not signing. But maybe that is the board's fault.

We've just got back from Bournemouth, feeling pretty hacked off anyway....then you see this (and the next post from Eaton)

Today was not an inept performance by the management...it was a sh1te performance by THE PLAYERS.  I have no problem with the 11 selected by AN today at all  - and I don't know how your stream was on your laptop, but Wes wasn't playing on the left - he was clearly playing (inasmuch as he was bloody playing at all!) in behind the striker.  Unfortunately he was awful - incapable of holding onto the ball or passing to a yellow shirt.  Vadis, who I was pleased to see start, was equally awful.  Russell Martin had another shocker, Bassong was a liability...I could go on and on.  Only player who escapes without censure for me was Johnny Howson who had a decent game.  Brady may be a better LM than LB but he is for me a better LB than Ollsson.  And as for Redmond, I really am worri he has lost it totally..every time he gets the ball he turns away from goal, comes inside and plays a 'pass the buck' pass sideways.

That team as picked should have had enough to make that a far closer game - but they played poorly.  Simple as that.  Bournemouth did to us today what we did to them at our place

Finally, my little lad was our mascot today, and I just have to give AFCB credit for the high class way they looked after him, and to the NCFC players who treated him great - especially Russell Martin who he said was amazingly lovely and made time to chat to him...top man (if only he could stop crosses!)

But it doesn't matter which 11 the manager picks, if they decide to have a collective off-day he ly do much about it.  But if our pressing need for a quality centre half, a striker who can find the net and Steven Naismith to replace Wes wasn't clear to the board before the match, it flipping should be now. 

 

[Din]

"This is absolutely embarrasing. The most lacklustre joke of a performance I have seen for a long time, and of all the games to perform this poorly in it's this one, which is such a big game. We need new signings all over the pitch because based on this we are nowhere near good enough for this level. Absolutely pathetic with a difficult run of games coming up."

Your post earlier.

I don't think I need to go further other than to say I am not saying anything out of character. If you read many of my posts I have criticised the management team and have said whatever talent AN has, it is not enough at the moment and he needs help. For him to say he can't put his finger on why we played so badly is another example of him not admitting he picked the wrong team and he has to start taking responsibilty.

And I am absolutely astonished when I read some posts on here and particularly the Pink Un site, that so many think anyone who dares criticise is either a wnaker, moron, plastic or whatever or the Thatcheresque you don't understand what the manager is trying to achieve, even though he can't put his finger on it.

Tell me what our style or tactics are supposed to be. When we had possession today we passed it without any real idea of what we were aiming to do. We all saw that after the first 10 minutes. And yet there was no change of personnel or tactics until 56 minutes!

I have no idea what the club's ambition is other than stay up if you can. 17th will do is not much of a five year plan. No ground capacity increase, mustn't pay good money and bring in talent it will break the wages structure show no thought of looking ahead.

I really thought this season was going to be different but it is just another one just like the last one under Hughton. what happened to the progressive football of earlier in the season? Ditched in favour of a couple of dull wins against Villa and Saints.

 I really want my club to succeed and play attractive skilful football. We've seen that once recently, well seven weeks ago, the second half against Arsenal. If we go down then so be it but lets not surrender the status.

Yes that is my quote from earlier, but I don't understand what that really has to do anything?

And when did I ever say you were a moron or that you didn't understand? If your opinion is that Alex Neil is out of his depth then fine, but surely if I disagree with that then I'm entitled to tell you that? I was simply stating that after the Villa/Southampton games I didn't see you, or anyone, complaining about the way we performed. Yet when our form turns it's only then that you decide that we weren't good enough in those games.

When did I say as well that Alex Neil got it all right today? He clearly didn't get it completely right because we lost 3-0. However the back 5 was the same as that that kept consecutive clean sheets, so why can they perform so well one week and dreadfully another? It's because the individual players are not top quality and are therefore inconsistent. There's nothing Alex Neil can do about that, except for try and sign improvements when he can, something that he is clearly working hard to improve because we're set to sign both Klose and Naismith for a combined £17m, plus we've already added Pinto.

I also don't know what you expect to be honest in regards to the club's ambition being 'just trying to stay up'. We have one of the weakest squads in the league and one of the smallest budgets in league. Do you honestly expect us to be challenging for the top 10? This season, staying up is the aim, if we do that then Alex Neil has done a good job. The fact that a lot of our players aren't good enough and yet we are still outside the relegation zone says what a good job he's doing. With the squad and finances we have if you honestly expect us to be doing better then I'm sorry but that's naive. 

 

[eatonparkboy]

Your earlier post was OK actually. It was full of anguish after watching as bad a game as there has been recently. And emotion is what football is all about. But now you have time to refIect you have taken a different attitude. 

I am not getting into a contest about who said what on what site.  I does happen in this site but in a kinder way.

To be honest I am a bit fed up with the pathetic excuses coming out now. Weak squad, poorest club etc. I'm sorry but because I said I didn't care what division we played in, I was told I was unambitious and had the little Norwich syndrome.

I think it is the reverse here. Reason after reason other than the real one. 

 

[lyb]

That was relegation standard, that performance. Many more of them against teams we should be getting something from and we've had it.

 

[splutcho]

Throwing an FA Cup game results in the start of a *bleep* run of form. Who'd have thunk it.

 

[Killiecanary]

 
And when did I ever say you were a moron or that you didn't understand? If your opinion is that Alex Neil is out of hbut surely if I disagree with that then I'm entitled to tell you that? I was simply stating that after the Villa/Southampton games I didn't see you, or anyone, complaining about the way we performed. Yet when our form turns it's only then that you decide that we weren't good enough in those games.

When did I say as well that Alex Neil got it all right today? He clearly didn't get it completely right because we lost 3-0. However the back 5 was the same as that that kept consecutive clean sheets, so why can they perform so well one week and dreadfully another? It's because the individual players are not top quality and are therefore inconsistent. There's nothing Alex Neil can do about that, except for try and sign improvements when he can, something that he is clearly working hard to improve because we're set to sign both Klose and Naismith for a combined £17m, plus we've already added Pinto.

I also don't know what you expect to be honest in regards to the club's ambition being 'just trying to stay up'. We have one of the weakest squads in the league and we're one of the poorest clubs in league. Do you honestly expect us to be challenging for the top 10? This season, staying up is the aim, if we do that then Alex Neil has done a good job. The fact that a lot of our players aren't good enough and yet we are still outside the relegation zone says what a good job he's doing. With the squad and finances we have if you honestly expect us to be doing better then I'm sorry but that's naive. 

Din - Nail.  Head. Hit

 

[Personal Trainer]

Just a thought, but are our Republic of Ireland players beginning to think too much about Euros 2016, both Wes and Brady going off the boil at the same time or is the former having his usual mid-season dip and the latter sulking because he is having to play LB. While I agree Ollson is not the best LB, I think the Ollson / Brady pairing down the left worked quite well.

 

[Killiecanary]

That was relegation standard, that performance. Many more of them against teams we should be getting something from and we've had it.

that's what surprised me though - we've generally been really good at those type of games so far this season - home wins over Swansea, Bournemouth Villa and away at Sunderland.  Apart from a mad half hour at Newcastle up till yesterday I was confident we were doing just what we needed to in those games.  I expected much better yesterday.

But that said I think we still need 4 wins and a couple of draws from 16 games....with Newcastle, Sunderland, Watford, West Ham at home to play and Villa and Swansea away.  Villa are gone, Sunderland looked even worse then we did yesterday from what I saw and Swansea are imploding...

still a little Sunday morning optimism here...

 

[ZLF]

There is a core in this squad that has continually put in no show efforts - dating back to Hughtons days.   2 quick games and an hour v 10 men will have an impact.   Most fans were not surprised by the XI and few would have had many changes.  But the lack of energy or sense was shocking.   As its happened under at least 3 managers now (lambert too) it is something squarely at the door of the players,  attitude, psyche;   I suspect we will need to change more players before this thing disappears.   

What did we learn?  Not much new but what stood out from yesterday was

1. The defence is champs standard.                                                                                                                                                                                                               

9 goals conceded in a week;  Pinto and a cb have to be starting next week (klose or whoever) will solve the right hand side but the left is a problem too. Martins weaknesses are evident,  but afobe, a championship striker playing against championship defenders, put a glaring spotlight on Ryans issues too  Bassong & Brady are the best options we have in those positions but they have prem league level issues too. 

2 The midfield has held the defence together                                                                                                                                                                                                          

Yesterday was a shocking effort from all of the midfield,  second to everything,  lazy challenges if at all,  no attacking intent.  Jarvis beyond anonymous, VOO was a defensive liability on the right and will be lucky to start next week.  we were left chasing the ball and holding no defensive shape at all.  The effort and commitment from all 7 was unacceptable (no pressing, no width)  but did refocus the light on the defencive frailties

3 Howson should never play def midfield again                                                                                                                                                                                               

For a start its a waste of his talent;  but he was simply lost in the holding role;  the ball moved around him too easily no ball recovery and not positive in retaining possession either.   It was no surprise to see the team improve once Dorrans came on and be more effective deep allowing Howson to advance up the pitch and be    better. 

4 The creativity has gone                                                                                                                                                                                                                                

We can all see that Redmond & Wes are currently off form - and despite the ignorant baying masses that does not mean they are crap.    However what it has        highlighted is how dependent them we are to create chances. Nearly 60% of our goals involve them (14/24) directly;  Add in key passes that % is even higher -       such as Wes involvement in Howsons midweek effort.   We are overly dependent on them,  and others (howson, VOO, Jarvis, Brady, full backs) have to contribute more.  Playing VOO in the middle,  or the signing of Naismith will hopefully help

5 We need a striker                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      

Afode demonstrated what is missing from Mbokani;  immobile, didnt win one of his 5 headers in the final third or hold the ball up well.   We simply had no goal threat.   Jeromes chemistry with him is non existant so its not an option to go 442 with them and Lafferty is not the solution.       

A 6 day rest will hopefully enable the players to re-energise and bring the commitment back and demonstrate that this is a regular one off that we will bounce back from - supplemented with the use of the new faces.   

 

[morty]

Picking up on your point about creativity, the time has come to stop relying on Wes. It seems a long, long time since he turned a game for us, I honestly think his time as a regular starter is coming to an end. If Redmond needs a cuddle ( as he really looks like he does) how about we promote him to the role just behind the striker. Let him know he's important to the team, get him more involved.

As for the rest, I have as much idea as Alex Neil had in his post game interview, on paper that looked like an exciting, attacking team, very capable of winning the game. In practise it looked leaden footed and second to everything. Did the Stoke game affect energy levels? Quite possibly. Could Alex Neil have rested anyone and put out a different side? Maybe? 

Its not the end of the world, but the how we perform against Liverpool will decide if this is a blip, or a rut.

 

[Indy_Bones]

Here's my take on how the players performed:

Rudd - pretty solid game (albeit lucky that we had covering defenders for the Afobe challenge),looks set to keep Ruddy out all season on current form.

Martin - another dodgy display showing limited marking ability and was getting battered by pretty much EVERY player who went against him (lack of support from VOO didn't help either)

Bennett - decent champs level performance, but currently struggling to justify being good enough for this level, let's hope the Timm Klose rumour is true.

Bassong - still our best overall defender even taking into account the lapses in concentration and form, needs better alongside him however and still a risk on occasion.

Brady - I don't care what anyone says, he's not, and likely never will be a left back. Struggles defensively and due to the role doesn't get forward and get his great crosses in anywhere near as much as he should. Either play him left wing or not at all.

Howson - restricted by the role and despite a couple of decent covering tackles did little of note and certainly provided almost no attacking impetus or drive

Tettey - one of Tettey's weaker performances, but arguably this was partly because the rest of the team was so poor and gave him little to work with and he spent most of his time trying to put out fires.

Jarvis - somehow managed to turn in a performance so poor that it makes Downing look world class, didn't seem fully fit, as off the pace and created little.

VOO - looked somewhat lost and wasted on the right, helped less defensively than Hux did in his glory days and never really seemed likely to go past his man. Should be playing more centrally in a box-to-box role as our very own "poor man's" Yaya.

Wes - don't even get me started, worst player on the pitch today, created nothing, constantly lost the ball, and showed none of his creative flair or ability. On current form should be warming the bench for the near future.

Mbokani - didn't rate the guy when we loaned him, rate him even less now, utterly immobile performance where he won almost nothing, challenged for almost nothing, squandered the limited chances he was given and frankly made me wish we'd got Becchio back instead...send him home ASAP and get someone genuinely good to replace him.

Redmond - Came on and added little of note, looks down on confidence and far less threatening on attack, can't believe this is the same player from the play-off final and start of the season tbh.

Jerome - probably wondering what he's done wrong to be behind Mbokani, looked solid enough when subbed on, but the damage had already been done and it's clear that he and Mbokani just can't play together at all. Head and shoulders our best striker ATM, but sadly that's still not saying much.

Dorrans - our final sub of the game and a pretty anonymous one as well. looked more comfortable than Howson in the deeper role, but again the team were playing so badly that anyone would have struggled to get something going.

Let's hope that Pinto replaces Russ next game with Klose coming in for Bennett, Wes gets moved to the bench for VOO with Redmond coming in on the right, Brady back on the left with Olsson returning behind him and either Jerome or a new striker starting upfront. I'd also rest Howson for Mulumbu as he handles a more defensive role better IMHO.

 

[Killiecanary]

Agree with every word apart from Howson, who was IMO the only city player capable of finding a yellow shirt or occasionally winning a tackle.  Best of a very bad bunch for me - I concede that is a relative perception though Indy.

 

[Dubai Mark]

Some powerful stuff, really good read and all without personal insults, good board this! Agree, I also thought Howson was the best if a bad bunch, and with better company around him, and played in the right position each week I am convinced he will  show himself week in week out as a top player......also,  Bassong remained our best defender, plus Russell Martin got zero support, and as a consequence was on a hiding to nothing. 

 

[Din]

Have to say I think people are being slightly harsh on Mbokani. I thought he held the ball up well, worked hard off the ball and overall was probably one of our better performers (although that was mainly down to how bad most of the others were).

That said his passing in general was poor and he should've done a lot better when he went through on goal at the end. For me though he's still our best all-round striker. That said, he has 3 goals this season, which just isn't good enough.

 

[Killiecanary]

You're clearly a nicer person than me Din!  I like him generally too but yesterday he was just clumsy and poor.  And when you're playing in that position and having a mare the only thing left is to work your knackers off and be as much of a nuisance as you possible can, and I didn't really see that from him.  I though Cam was better than him yesterday, although generally I think they are pretty much on a par...and interchangeable.