Youth contracts / comings and goings.

[hogesar]

Once Canos got into the team regularly at Brentford he looked quite good to be fair but not to a point where he looked to have anything more in his locker than either of the Murphy's. 

 

[hogesar]

Also, presuming 12.5m is about right, how much would people like to see re-invested? I think it's a bit naive to think we'll invest all of that but you'd like to think we'd spend around half of that.

 

[Fenway Frank]

I guess it will depend on who stays or leaves, Naismith and Klose must be on a good amount so if they both stay then it will help with that and we could spend half

 

[morty]

Paddy Davitt saying on twitter that he expects us to clear our overdraft and bring in one or two more players.

 

[hogesar]

Gentle reminder as to who we're losing..

 

[morty]

We never really had much choice though unfortunately. If I was going to be picky, theres not one Premiership goal in there lol.

And his brother is better anyway

 

[hogesar]

Always have a choice but I understand 12m is hard to turn down - little bit shocking if the first thing we're looking to do is pay off a 5m overdraft (clubs are allowed to run in sustainable debt for a while but nevermind).

It's just worth remembering the quality Jacob has that as soon as it's made clear he's leaving, people have forgotten about and, whilst you're tongue in cheek, a lot of people aren't.

For example, a recent post on FB that I thought earnt a tearing apart:

"Good riddance, over rated by Norwich fans, weak, took to long to release the ball hardly ever tracked back, josh the better out of the pair"

 

[morty]

Always have a choice but I understand 12m is hard to turn down - little bit shocking if the first thing we're looking to do is pay off a 5m overdraft (clubs are allowed to run in sustainable debt for a while but nevermind).

It's just worth remembering the quality Jacob has that as soon as it's made clear he's leaving, people have forgotten about and, whilst you're tongue in cheek, a lot of people aren't.

For example, a recent post on FB that I thought earnt a tearing apart:

"Good riddance, over rated by Norwich fans, weak, took to long to release the ball hardly ever tracked back, josh the better out of the pair"

Anyone who sticks their lip out and says he is over rated is an absolute bell, and deserves a thorough caning. And that is also why I left the fans group on facebook, reading it is like being punched in the face with stupid.

We are where we are, and have to cover the possibility of not going up this season, and having a drastically cut income next season. I like our club, and how it is set up, and people really shouldn't cry about what it isn't, or what they think it could be!

 

[Canaryboy]

We've sold 2 players, one of which decided he wanted to go back up North before Webber arrived and another that you just said you hadn't seen have a good game for Norwich, the latter for a lot more money than his career so far suggests he's worth.
 
As for half a squad, we have 23 players in Germany once Jacob has gone, not counting the two that would have been there but for injuries which are obviously out of anyones hands. So 25 players. Half of whose squad?! Chelsea's?!
 

We've sold Dorrans and Rudd too? 

I'm just a bit worried that's all, although I did notice that we've been very late publishing new squad numbers so it suggests we expect more activity. 

Of the 24 man 'senior' squad we've cobbled together for the Germany tour which is now actually a 23 man squad we've got 4 goalkeepers, 3 left backs, and have just sold a winger which leaves us with just 2 wingers, both left wingers, and we've still only got 1 right back unless you want to count Russell Martin as one of those, you can but that would leave us with just 2 centre backs if we did.

Webber made a big deal about the squad being unbalanced when he arrived, how we had no permanent left back but three attacking midfielders etc, but its arguably much more lopsided as it stands now... we've got 3 left backs but only 4 centre midfielders for a team which plays 3 of them at a time, only 2 wingers and they are both left wingers, and 1 right back because we haven't replaced Whittaker. 

We still need a good 4 or 5 players in the right positions before we've got anywhere near the level of depth we need, and that's assuming no more departures? 

 

[Canaryboy]

little bit shocking if the first thing we're looking to do is pay off a 5m overdraft (clubs are allowed to run in sustainable debt for a while but nevermind).

If it is literally an overdraft and that's not a 'figure of speech' then an overdraft is far from the cheapest form of borrowing..... e.g. if I wanted one on my business account the interest rate would be 5% above base rate, so 5.25%. Would really need to convert it into an actual loan with fixed repayment terms if they wanted to keep that debt for a while. 

 

[Canaryboy]

Lets use some of this big chunk of cash we have to try and pay off Jarvis, McGovern and Andreu, No point in the three of them hanging around. 

 

[morty]

Lets use some of this big chunk of cash we have to try and pay off Jarvis, McGovern and Andreu, No point in the three of them hanging around. 

We can get fees for Andreu (he scored loads last season in Scotland) and McGovern if he wants to go, theres nothing to be gained from paying them off, as you also need money to replace them, and you may even need them is we have a freakish run of injuries.

Jarvis, we're saddled with.

 

[splutcho]

We've sold Dorrans and Rudd too? 

Forgot about Dorrans, but the same applies as with Howson. Always wanted to go when Rangers became interested. 

Rudd I wasn't counting because his departure is of absolutely no consequence given he's not good enough to play at Championship level.

I wouldn't call either of them our best players, nor anywhere close.

 

[Canaryboy]

We'll have to pay to make the moves happen. Both probably on about a grand a week in Scotland and far more here, so in the event of them finding a club they'll be asking us for the difference to make the move happen. 

Dread to think what both of them are earning here compared with what they can get elsewhere. If Andreu is on £8k a week here for example and can get £1.5k a week in Scotland, then he's going to want us to pay him about £300k to leave (£6.5k per week for the rest of his contract).

Pales into insignificance compared with what Matt Jarvis is probably earning, dread to think what sort of pressure he is putting on our cashflow, but if he's on £25k a week then the remainder of his contract is worth about £2.5m.... If he'd take £1.25m to just leave now, would you take it? 

 

[Canaryboy]

Rudd I wasn't counting because his departure is of absolutely no consequence given he's not good enough to play at Championship level.

Simon Grayson thought he was, paid £1m for him and handed him the number 1 shirt. I'm a Rudd fan personally, probably because I was at Rotherham away a few years back when he put in one of the best performances I've seen from a City keeper, in the pub afterwards waiting for a train and had loads of Rotherham fans asking about "that keeper". 

 

[Canaryboy]

By the way, I'm not one of those people who is saying that everybody we've signed is cheap and therefore must not be good enough, in fact I welcome the return to doing business that way and its been our route to success in the past. Stringer built a great team with other peoples rejects, and both Worthington and Lambert took lower league players and got them playing fantastically by putting belief in them and putting emphasis on team spirit. 

I'm just a bit anxious at the moment, a lot of people are I think. I'm taking solace in the fact that we have opted to delay releasing new squad numbers and hope that this is because the club expects more incoming activity rather than them not wanting to issue refunds to the thousands of people who would get Oliviera and Pritchard printed on the back of their shirts. The biggest concern that I have at the moment is the inbalance of the squad again. Marley Watkins isn't a very good winger, he's just been playing as a striker for two seasons, we've not got enough centre midfielders, and we're still overcrowded in that attacking midfielder position. We need at least one more defender, either a right back or a centre back. I know that Godfrey is very versatile and can play pretty much anywhere but you can't bank on one player being your backup for 3 positions simultaneously, he'll also never fulfill his potential if he's moved all over the place, we've seen it time and time again with young players not making a position their own. 

This is one of the things that Webber made a huge deal out of when he arrived, the simple things like having two left backs on the books. We got off to a good start with getting transfers in early but seem to have slowed down now, its going to be to our detriment if we bring in too many players who haven't gone through our pre-season. You sign a player on 31st August and chances are he isn't making an impact until October or November, I suspect there are more players who need a 'bedding in' period than there are those who get the ground running straight away, especially when buying from overseas (remember Alex Neil said that he knew Oliviera would need a few months to get firing? That was despite having played 28 games for Forest the year prior). 

Our own players have said that there is a lot for them to learn to get playing the Farke way and that its a steep learning curve and they are having to adjust to his physical demands, so what good is a player going to be to us if they are coming in late August if our existing players need a 5 week pre-season to get used to Farke's ideas and will then be 4 or 5 games into season? 

I'm also mindful though that we've been a bit spoilt with big name players in the past few years, so perhaps fans have to adjust to that. We can all get ridiculously excited about signing Naismith for £8m and use that to measure our progress as a club, but can't get so excited about some bloke that they've never heard of for £600k, but of course those two players could be of similar quality.... Grant Holt £600k. Its a new way of doing things and I think a bit of adversity to change and anxiety is natural when things change so radically.

And we've had examples of times we've built teams on the cheap and thrived (Lambert, Worthington), and other times when it has all gone terribly wrong. I can remember Norwich fans being optimistic about the League One season under Bryan Gunn, and getting excited about how Matt Gill "knew the league", and the fact that Goran Maric had played for Barcelona reserves, and Cody McDonald was going to tear League 1 apart. 

Didn't take long for the truth to out, our pre-season was a shambles and our management team didn't have a clue what it was doing, a proper manager came in and never played Goran Maric because he could chest the ball further than Lambert could kick it (when trying to control the ball with his chest). So understandable that fans are wary and some are reserving judgement. 

 

[morty]

Saw a rumour, likely rubbish that Jacob had failed his medical.

Well they are taking their time in announcing him.....

How funny would that be?

 

[morty]

Reports that Boro have bid 4 million for Josh Murphy!

Second word in the answer is "off".

 

[Canaryboy]

and another that you just said you hadn't seen have a good game for Norwich

Just for the record by the way, I did mean games that I'd actually attended, which last season was only away games. Including Sheffield Wednesday where was the worst player on the pitch and withdrawn at half time.

I did get to watch a few home games from the comfort of my living room.

 

[morty]

Jacob to Toon confirmed.